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      11-01-2015, 03:33 AM   #1
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Good kit to start polishing with? New to polishing

Looking at this one from Detailed Image:

http://www.detailedimage.com/DI-Pack...205-pads-P438/

Includes porter cable 7424XP random orbital, pads, backing plate, and polish.

Haven't polished before using a machine but have read/watched a ton about it.

Any other recommendations?

I have Black Sapphire Metallic paint with what I would call light to medium swirl marks.
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      11-01-2015, 08:36 AM   #2
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Welcome to the world of polishing! Here is the most important tip: Put ONE black mark on the backing plate and make sure the pad (and the plate, obviously) is constantly spinning when you polish. If it stops or slows to less than 2-3 rpm, you're applying too much pressure.

I learned this the hard way and it took me one season to figure out why I wasn't getting good results. Now I can achieve consistent results if I make sure the pad spins.
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      11-01-2015, 10:57 AM   #3
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I'm interested too. Same paint, sounds like same condition, and also thinking about getting into paint correction
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      11-01-2015, 09:05 PM   #4
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I purchased the Griots Garage 6in DA. More powerful and lifetime warranty.
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      11-01-2015, 09:35 PM   #5
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I purchased the Griots Garage 6in DA. More powerful and lifetime warranty.
I've heard that one is pretty good as well. Lifetime warranty sounds really nice vs. the Porter which is only 3 years.
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      11-02-2015, 12:01 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
Looking at this one from Detailed Image:

http://www.detailedimage.com/DI-Pack...205-pads-P438/

Includes porter cable 7424XP random orbital, pads, backing plate, and polish.

Haven't polished before using a machine but have read/watched a ton about it.

Any other recommendations?

I have Black Sapphire Metallic paint with what I would call light to medium swirl marks.
That looks like a great kit to start with. I have spent that much on my supplies. Read my thread "working on swirlies" and you will find all kinds of good info for noobs like us. I ended up going to M105 and it works the best. I am still in the process--I have achieved more than 80% swirl reduction and have BSM. I have found with limited Micro-towels and pads you really can only do a little bit at a time..unless you have a wash and dry system for them.
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      11-02-2015, 12:22 AM   #7
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Chemical guys with their v32-38. Awesome stuff for beginners and professional. Have never found a product that is so easy to work with, have such good results and smells so good

http://www.chemicalguys.com/Rupes_LH..._p/buf_402.htm
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      11-02-2015, 12:53 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgoens View Post
That looks like a great kit to start with. I have spent that much on my supplies. Read my thread "working on swirlies" and you will find all kinds of good info for noobs like us. I ended up going to M105 and it works the best. I am still in the process--I have achieved more than 80% swirl reduction and have BSM. I have found with limited Micro-towels and pads you really can only do a little bit at a time..unless you have a wash and dry system for them.
Yea, I've been reading that one recently as well and there's tons of info. I'd like to try to get it right the first time .

What pads did you use with the M105?

Also, did you do another combination of polish and pad after making passes with the M105? I saw that it looks like just with M105 and cutting pad you can get a dull finish if you don't finish with a finer polish afterwards.

Also, I think my swirls are probably similar to yours. Enough to be quite annoying but not as bad as that X5 that DI posted in your working on swirlies thread.
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      11-02-2015, 12:44 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
Yea, I've been reading that one recently as well and there's tons of info. I'd like to try to get it right the first time .

What pads did you use with the M105?

Also, did you do another combination of polish and pad after making passes with the M105? I saw that it looks like just with M105 and cutting pad you can get a dull finish if you don't finish with a finer polish afterwards.

Also, I think my swirls are probably similar to yours. Enough to be quite annoying but not as bad as that X5 that DI posted in your working on swirlies thread.
So, I've tried several products as you have read in my thread. Here's my advice--just go right to the orange pad with M105. Don't waste your time with less like I have. Then, use a finer polish after that. I found the M105 to be pretty shiny. Here's what happens: you can only do a bit at a time before your pad becomes saturated. Like, maybe 30 minutes and then it needs to be cleaned. What you will find is that after that nothing is happening. And your towel will have to be cleaned.
I would figure if you planned on doing a whole car in a day, it would take many pads and towels. I'm just talking about the paint correction part.
I tried Meguiers Ultimate Compound, Ultimate polish and Meguiers #7 which was a mistake because it is not for DA polishers and left haze everywhere. Take my word for it---just go 105 to start and remember, your towel for buffing it off has to be real clean or you make more little marks. It's all about everything being real clean as to not re-introduce scratches. And, once you start the process you have to wash correctly. I'm no expert but I have gotten quite a bit of experience on my car at this point.
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      11-02-2015, 03:24 PM   #10
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If you're looking to save some money, get the Harbor Freight 6" DA for around $50-$60 after coupons,:
http://www.harborfreight.com/6-in-57...her-69924.html

5" $15 backing plate on Amazon to replace the HF one
http://www.amazon.com/Astro-4607-Vel...+backing+plate

and M105/205 wherever you want and save over $100.

Professional detailers have been using the HF unit with very good results.
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      11-02-2015, 04:09 PM   #11
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The kit you've referenced is certainly a great option for a beginner package. The products included will certainly improve the looks of any vehicle.

If you purchase the kit mentioned, I would recommend the M105 on the Orange Pad to remove the majority of defects, followed by M205 on a white pad to enhance gloss.

Polishing How To with Meguiar’s M105 / M205 by Todd Cooperider


Since you're brand new to machine polishing, it will take a lot of time to complete this job. Even in the hands of a professional, a complete paint correction job is a very time consuming one... for someone who has no experience, it will take even longer. Do not rush. Plan accordingly and be patient. You will learn how to work the machine and products with experience.


You can use these other write ups featuring SBM BMW's as a guide.

BMW M6 Gran Coupe - Sapphire Black - Paint Correction & 22ple Coating Application

Black Sapphire Metallic X5 - Corrected & Coated

Let me know if you have any specific questions!

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
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      11-02-2015, 11:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgoens View Post
So, I've tried several products as you have read in my thread. Here's my advice--just go right to the orange pad with M105. Don't waste your time with less like I have. Then, use a finer polish after that. I found the M105 to be pretty shiny. Here's what happens: you can only do a bit at a time before your pad becomes saturated. Like, maybe 30 minutes and then it needs to be cleaned. What you will find is that after that nothing is happening. And your towel will have to be cleaned.
I would figure if you planned on doing a whole car in a day, it would take many pads and towels. I'm just talking about the paint correction part.
I tried Meguiers Ultimate Compound, Ultimate polish and Meguiers #7 which was a mistake because it is not for DA polishers and left haze everywhere. Take my word for it---just go 105 to start and remember, your towel for buffing it off has to be real clean or you make more little marks. It's all about everything being real clean as to not re-introduce scratches. And, once you start the process you have to wash correctly. I'm no expert but I have gotten quite a bit of experience on my car at this point.
Thanks! I have plenty of unused quality microfiber towels already ready for this job. How many pads would you recommend if I plan on doing a lot of work at a time without having to wash them?

Like you, I may have to driveway warrior this. What did you do to keep it in the shade? Use an ez-up or just work in the morning before the sun rises?
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      11-03-2015, 09:34 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Detailed Image View Post
The kit you've referenced is certainly a great option for a beginner package. The products included will certainly improve the looks of any vehicle.

If you purchase the kit mentioned, I would recommend the M105 on the Orange Pad to remove the majority of defects, followed by M205 on a white pad to enhance gloss.

Polishing How To with Meguiar’s M105 / M205 by Todd Cooperider


Since you're brand new to machine polishing, it will take a lot of time to complete this job. Even in the hands of a professional, a complete paint correction job is a very time consuming one... for someone who has no experience, it will take even longer. Do not rush. Plan accordingly and be patient. You will learn how to work the machine and products with experience.


You can use these other write ups featuring SBM BMW's as a guide.

BMW M6 Gran Coupe - Sapphire Black - Paint Correction & 22ple Coating Application

Black Sapphire Metallic X5 - Corrected & Coated

Let me know if you have any specific questions!

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
If I went with the 6in Griot's DA would it still be ideal to buy the M105/LC Orange Pads and M205/LC White Pads and use that combination or do you think another combination would be better? I noticed that with the X5 and M6 you worked on you used something different for the correcting although jgoens seemed to have success with M105. Maybe I'm overthinking this?

I'm not entirely fixed on getting one of the kit deals if there are better combinations out there.

Also after reading up on some of the articles, maybe I'm not seeing it, but how do you know how many passes to go by with the M105? Is there some rule of thumb? Other than the product itself drying up.

Also, in harder to reach areas do you just buy smaller pads and use those on the same buffer or does that not work because of the orbit?
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      11-03-2015, 12:38 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
Thanks! I have plenty of unused quality microfiber towels already ready for this job. How many pads would you recommend if I plan on doing a lot of work at a time without having to wash them?

Like you, I may have to driveway warrior this. What did you do to keep it in the shade? Use an ez-up or just work in the morning before the sun rises?
I have a tree in my front yard, so I wash it there. And then, my garage(which is a 1 car and used as an office) has a driveway in front that actually shields the sun at many parts of the day. In the morning the tree shields and then in the afternoon half my car is in the shade now that the sun lies low. I have done some polishing in muted sun and it has worked the same for me. How many pads? Well, I find the orange pad is done after a half an hour or so. And then I do some with the white pad. Basically, counting the time I spend with a wash, getting things out and putting away, I tend to do maybe 3 hours at a time. But I really wasted a lot of time with the wrong products. Make sure those microfiber towels are good ones--when your wiping off the polish after the machine it is real easy to introduce new scratches...believe me.
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      11-04-2015, 03:40 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
If I went with the 6in Griot's DA would it still be ideal to buy the M105/LC Orange Pads and M205/LC White Pads and use that combination or do you think another combination would be better? I noticed that with the X5 and M6 you worked on you used something different for the correcting although jgoens seemed to have success with M105. Maybe I'm overthinking this?

I'm not entirely fixed on getting one of the kit deals if there are better combinations out there.

Also after reading up on some of the articles, maybe I'm not seeing it, but how do you know how many passes to go by with the M105? Is there some rule of thumb? Other than the product itself drying up.

Also, in harder to reach areas do you just buy smaller pads and use those on the same buffer or does that not work because of the orbit?
I would still get orange and white pads, and M205 as well, but M105 is not my personal favorite compound. If you want to be prepared, you may also wish to pick up some microfiber cutting pads which are more aggressive than the orange light cutting pads.

I would recommend either Griot's Fast Correcting Creme or Meguiar's M100. I have found both to be easier to use than M105.

Keep in mind if you go with the Griot's Machine (which I highly recommend), you will also need to purchase a 5" backing plate and a 3" backing plate to fit the 5.5" and 3"pads. I do not recommend 6.5" pads as you will lose some cutting ability with the larger pads. Stick to 5.5" and 3" pads.


As far as how many passes are needed - it varies greatly depending on the defects you are working on removing. You should perform a series of test spots to determine the best paint correction process... check out this article for more information.

Analyzing Your Test Spot by Zach McGovern
Paint Correction: Pairing Products and Pads by Zach McGovern



Yes, the porter cable and griot's machines have interchangeable backing plates and you can use all sorts of pad sizes on the same machine. I recommend sticking to 5.5" and 3" pads as I mentioned above.


Let me know if you have any other questions.

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
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      11-05-2015, 01:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Detailed Image View Post
I would still get orange and white pads, and M205 as well, but M105 is not my personal favorite compound. If you want to be prepared, you may also wish to pick up some microfiber cutting pads which are more aggressive than the orange light cutting pads.

I would recommend either Griot's Fast Correcting Creme or Meguiar's M100. I have found both to be easier to use than M105.

Keep in mind if you go with the Griot's Machine (which I highly recommend), you will also need to purchase a 5" backing plate and a 3" backing plate to fit the 5.5" and 3"pads. I do not recommend 6.5" pads as you will lose some cutting ability with the larger pads. Stick to 5.5" and 3" pads.


As far as how many passes are needed - it varies greatly depending on the defects you are working on removing. You should perform a series of test spots to determine the best paint correction process... check out this article for more information.

Analyzing Your Test Spot by Zach McGovern
Paint Correction: Pairing Products and Pads by Zach McGovern



Yes, the porter cable and griot's machines have interchangeable backing plates and you can use all sorts of pad sizes on the same machine. I recommend sticking to 5.5" and 3" pads as I mentioned above.


Let me know if you have any other questions.

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
Thanks this was extremely helpful.

Basically the 6in backing plate it comes with isn't very helpful?

How does the M100 and Fast Correcting Creme compare to M105 in terms of aggressiveness?

I've also seen people spray like quick detailer (or something rather) onto the pads as well before polishing, is this also necessary?
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      11-05-2015, 08:55 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
Basically the 6in backing plate it comes with isn't very helpful?
Well, the thing is... when you use a larger pad, you have more surface area touching the vehicle. Assuming the pressure applied to the pad is constant, the more surface area you have touching the car, translates to less overall force (Force = Pressure / Area, so an increase in area translates to a decrease in force). So, for a smaller machine such as a Griot's or Porter Cable, I have found that a 5.5" pad is the "sweet spot" for doing the majority of the correction work. It cuts better than a 6.5" pad, and it also fits better on most vehicles as a 6.5" pad just won't work on curved panels or smaller areas. So, a 6.5" pad may be used for spreading wax or something like that, but in general I do find that 5.5" pads are just a better option in most situations. I even use 5.5" pads 99% of the time on my larger Rupes LHR21 and Griot's G21 machines even though they are built for use with 6.5"-7" pads.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
How does the M100 and Fast Correcting Creme compare to M105 in terms of aggressiveness?
You'll see that M100 is rated at the same 12/10 cut rating as M105 on the Meguiar's scale. I have found M100 to cut very similarly to M105, but M100 is just easier to work with. It has a longer working time which leads to less of a learning curve and less chance of user error & frustration. Fast Correcting Creme also has comparable cut and is considerably easier to work with as it also has a very long working time and produces a very low amount of dust when used with clean pads. To be perfectly honest, I haven't used M105 in years after finding other options that cut as well and are not as much of a hassle to work with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
I've also seen people spray like quick detailer (or something rather) onto the pads as well before polishing, is this also necessary?
Spraying water or quick detailer onto a pad was something that stemmed from the popularity of M105. This product has a tendency to dry out quickly during use, so a detailer by the name of Kevin Brown developed the water spritzing technique to extend the working time of the product. It is something I have never felt the need to do with any other product.


Let me know if you have any other questions

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
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      11-05-2015, 02:00 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Detailed Image View Post
Well, the thing is... when you use a larger pad, you have more surface area touching the vehicle. Assuming the pressure applied to the pad is constant, the more surface area you have touching the car, translates to less overall force (Force = Pressure / Area, so an increase in area translates to a decrease in force). So, for a smaller machine such as a Griot's or Porter Cable, I have found that a 5.5" pad is the "sweet spot" for doing the majority of the correction work. It cuts better than a 6.5" pad, and it also fits better on most vehicles as a 6.5" pad just won't work on curved panels or smaller areas. So, a 6.5" pad may be used for spreading wax or something like that, but in general I do find that 5.5" pads are just a better option in most situations. I even use 5.5" pads 99% of the time on my larger Rupes LHR21 and Griot's G21 machines even though they are built for use with 6.5"-7" pads.



You'll see that M100 is rated at the same 12/10 cut rating as M105 on the Meguiar's scale. I have found M100 to cut very similarly to M105, but M100 is just easier to work with. It has a longer working time which leads to less of a learning curve and less chance of user error & frustration. Fast Correcting Creme also has comparable cut and is considerably easier to work with as it also has a very long working time and produces a very low amount of dust when used with clean pads. To be perfectly honest, I haven't used M105 in years after finding other options that cut as well and are not as much of a hassle to work with.


Spraying water or quick detailer onto a pad was something that stemmed from the popularity of M105. This product has a tendency to dry out quickly during use, so a detailer by the name of Kevin Brown developed the water spritzing technique to extend the working time of the product. It is something I have never felt the need to do with any other product.


Let me know if you have any other questions

Zach McGovern
Detailed Image Ask-A-Pro Blog Author
www.AttentiontoDetailingPeoria.com
Thanks! Again this is really helpful as always. Your responses on this site alone get you my business
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      11-05-2015, 03:05 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brettb1234 View Post
Thanks! Again this is really helpful as always. Your responses on this site alone get you my business
I sincerely appreciate it

Always happy to help.

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      05-20-2016, 04:41 PM   #20
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That chemical guys kit looks cool, but I'd rather pay someone the $500 to correct my paint for me than spend that much as a beginner.. But for $150'ish from Detailed Image, that seems more reasonable for a beginner..
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