[Will_460cs]

Hi does any one have experience of the NOX sensor/emulator for sale here:

https://bimmerprofs.com/noxem-129/

[Dormermike]

Interested in this too. No sensor issues yet but suspect they are in the post..

[jamherber]

Wish I'd seen this when I had to replace the NOx sensor on our 330i last year. Would definitely have given it a go.

[AndyVR]

I've been reading the blog on that site, lots of good information on the N43/N53 engines if you want to understand how the fuelling/engine management works, particularly lambda & Nox sensor , injector and coilpack issues.

From what I've read there, it sounds like unless the Nox Sensor & Nox cat are working properly, the engine will never run perfectly because the DME stops adaptations and fuel trims being performed.

Going to try their method for resetting/performing adaptations (drive procedure) after changing a Fuel injector.

[tim_s]

I've not really got my head around this product. Why do they think it's a good idea to replace the nox sensor with a lambda probe and an emulator? I couldn't really work it out. Reliability of the sensor (on the basis that nox sensors are less reliable than lambda probes)? But even knowing they're not terribly reliable and having just changed one in my e90 I'd still hedge my bets on the reliability of an oem nox sensor over this. I don't really have much idea about nox sensor function/output but in my head in order to provide nox feedback to the DME, a nox sensor will give better results than a lambda probe.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by tim_s

I've not really got my head around this product. Why do they think it's a good idea to replace the nox sensor with a lambda probe and an emulator? I couldn't really work it out. Reliability of the sensor (on the basis that nox sensors are less reliable than lambda probes)? But even knowing they're not terribly reliable and having just changed one in my e90 I'd still hedge my bets on the reliability of an oem nox sensor over this. I don't really have much idea about nox sensor function/output but in my head in order to provide nox feedback to the DME, a nox sensor will give better results than a lambda probe.

I've been looking at it as my cars done a few miles (125k) and needs a NOX sensor - I'd like to get back to reliable stratified mode.

Their solution removes the worry of other issues relating to NOX ie. degradation of the NOX catalyst as it can be effectively removed after fitting this..

I'm in two minds too... Guess I may guinee pig it!

I'm going to find out if the Lamba they use is off the shelf in case of future failures..

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by AndyVR

I've been reading the blog on that site, lots of good information on the N43/N53 engines if you want to understand how the fuelling/engine management works, particularly lambda & Nox sensor , injector and coilpack issues.

From what I've read there, it sounds like unless the Nox Sensor & Nox cat are working properly, the engine will never run perfectly because the DME stops adaptations and fuel trims being performed.

Going to try their method for resetting/performing adaptations (drive procedure) after changing a Fuel injector.

Be careful if your changing just one... read up on mixing different versions if you're not already aware.

[AndyVR]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

Be careful if your changing just one... read up on mixing different versions if you're not already aware.

Ta, yeah I've read up on this but never found anything concrete..lots of different opinions, dealers seemed to replace 1 injector under warranty? old injectors are index 8, just fitted one index 11 - I'll see how it runs after adaptations done.

[Dormermike]

It basically sends the "ok" message to the DME doesn't it? So engine runs stratified regardless of nox catalyst state. I would imagine this would increase nox emissions and decrease nox catalyst lifespan. On flip side lower fuel consumption.

Does anyone know how bad the n53 nox emissions actually are? Compared to say a 3.0 diesel?

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by Dormermike

It basically sends the "ok" message to the DME doesn't it? So engine runs stratified regardless of nox catalyst state. I would imagine this would increase nox emissions and decrease nox catalyst lifespan. On flip side lower fuel consumption.

Does anyone know how bad the n53 nox emissions actually are? Compared to say a 3.0 diesel?

Shouldn't damage the NOX catalyst, as the NOX catalyst is a like a water tank once its full it has to regenerate which is acomplished at certain/speeds temperature... However gradual ageing is the killer for NOX cat.

Nox emissions are not bad and they wrote a good piece on the technical side well worth reading if your inclined.

[Dormermike]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

Shouldn't damage the NOX catalyst, as the NOX catalyst is a like a water tank once its full it has to regenerate which is acomplished at certain/speeds temperature... However gradual ageing is the killer for NOX cat.

Nox emissions are not bad and they wrote a good piece on the technical side well worth reading if your inclined.

Nox catalyst won't regenerate if using the emulator though will it? I did read it but was a while ago. So I guess using the water tank analogy once it's full it's going to overflow.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by Dormermike

Nox catalyst won't regenerate if using the emulator though will it? I did read it but was a while ago. So I guess using the water tank analogy once it's full it's going to overflow.

Indeed! although from my read most Nox is present when running stratified I
think... in the faqs section:

Q4: Will emissions rise significantly if I will install NOXEM instead OEM NOx sensor?

A4: Situation is little bit complicated than it look’s at the first moment.
At idle, N43/N53 engine can work in both Homogeneous mode and in Stratified charge mode as well. In Homogeneous mode NOx content is close to 0 (and is reduced by CO converters), and there is no difference between NOXEM and OEM sensor. If Stratified charge is selected at idle, NOx amount is small (because amount of burned fuel also is very small). At idle MSD80 does not makes any decisions based on NOx content (i.e.: does not controls efficiency of NOx catalytic converter) – there is no difference between NOXEM and OEM NOx sensor.
At loads more than 60% (corresponding driving speed: from 120 .. 160km/h, depending on engine) engine switches to Homogeneous mode and emitted NOx content is close to 0. In homogeneous mode NOx content is reduced by using CO converters, not NOx converter. And again – there is no difference between NOXEM and OEM NOx sensor.
At low loads NOx content corresponds to EURO4/5, if remaining efficiency of NOx converter is around at least 10 .. 20% because of small amount of burned fuel and high efficiency of engine.
The worst region (from emission side) is driving with speed 70..120..160km/h, while engine performs Stratified charge. In this area NOx content could exceed allowed limits if remaining efficiency of NOx converter is low. In the same time – content of CO and CH is significantly lower comparing with same engine, working on Homogeneous mode (if there are problems with NOx system).
Moreover – almost all of N43/N53 series engines with NOx system problems (error messages related to NOx converter and/or NOx sensor) are working with serious unevenness – as the result of un-optimal fuel/air ratio, and produce very high levels of CO and CH. Installing of NOXEM solve problems with long term fuel mixture adaptation creation, restores correct fuel mixture and reduce CO and CH content while engine performs Homogeneous mode.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by Dormermike

Nox catalyst won't regenerate if using the emulator though will it? I did read it but was a while ago. So I guess using the water tank analogy once it's full it's going to overflow.

I can't see any reason why the NOX catalyst would work as normal. The NOX sensor is just there to measure NOX emitted post catalyst doing its job.

[Dormermike]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

I can't see any reason why the NOX catalyst would work as normal. The NOX sensor is just there to measure NOX emitted post catalyst doing its job.

Not sure. I was under the impression the DME initiates the regeneration of the nox catalyst.. or something... which implies that it is triggered, which I presumed the emulator would not do.

[AndyVR]

That's the bit I didn't understand, does the Nox cat get regenerated from time to time with an Emulator (via DME increased exhaust temps/Vanos etc) , or does it just become redundant and full, but with no detriment to performance/economy?

I did a fast motorway run the other night to try and do the forced regeneration of the Nox cat, using INPA to monitor it, I only have the basic 1.0something INPA loader which doesn't have a Desulphurisation screen, but on the 'NOx sensor' screen the values seemed to be stuck (NOx concentration -150 ppm!) so looks like my sensor might be dead, yet I have only have one regular error code 30EA (Denox cat converter sulphurised)

They claim that their emulator has a far longer lifespan than a new NOx sensor... and if I was to buy a new NOx sensor, I don't know if my NOx cat is actually still working or has any life left in it so could be a waste of money.

[Will_460cs]

Here is the answer, as suspected no impact to function of NOX catalyst
;

Q11: Does the use of NOXEM differs from exploitation of original exhaust system, installed by manufacturer?

A11: No, the exploitation of NOXEM does not differ from exploitation of NOx sensor, supplied by manufacturer. The engine will perform all intended functions as with original NOx sensor, including regeneration and desulphation of NOx catalytic converter.

[Will_460cs]

Originally Posted by AndyVR

That's the bit I didn't understand, does the Nox cat get regenerated from time to time with an Emulator (via DME increased exhaust temps/Vanos etc) , or does it just become redundant and full, but with no detriment to performance/economy?

I did a fast motorway run the other night to try and do the forced regeneration of the Nox cat, using INPA to monitor it, I only have the basic 1.0something INPA loader which doesn't have a Desulphurisation screen, but on the 'NOx sensor' screen the values seemed to be stuck (NOx concentration -150 ppm!) so looks like my sensor might be dead, yet I have only have one regular error code 30EA (Denox cat converter sulphurised)

They claim that their emulator has a far longer lifespan than a new NOx sensor... and if I was to buy a new NOx sensor, I don't know if my NOx cat is actually still working or has any life left in it so could be a waste of money.

INPA 2.xx loader files

https://bimmerprofs.com/msd80-loader-2-023/


will be trying them at the weekend..

[Will_460cs]

I have ultrasonically cleaned my NOX sensor, and touch wood... it is performing without error..

[Dormermike]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

I have ultrasonically cleaned my NOX sensor, and touch wood... it is performing without error..

So you resurrected it ? Cool!

[AndyVR]

Originally Posted by Will_460cs

INPA 2.xx loader files

https://bimmerprofs.com/msd80-loader-2-023/


will be trying them at the weekend..

Cheers for that, well spotted.

Reading bimmerprofs again, looks like one of my issues is dodgy exhaust temperature readings (showing only 103°C after a long run!!) they say Nox sensor only starts sending data at 220°C.
Looking at the parts manuals, the N43 has a separate temperature sensor in the exhaust, maybe I'll check that out first.


Well done on the Ultrasonic cleaning, you have the kit yourself or did you take it somewhere?

[Will_460cs]

yeah with a little ultrasonic cleaner that i have... there pretty cheap things these days.... and distiller water (actually from the dehumidifier)

[Tr1ppy]

So can we potentially remove the secondary cats with this Nox emulator. The reason for removal would be for increased noise and slightly better performance.

The Emulator would tell the DME that the cat is still in place and everything is normal, right?