E90Post
 


 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > E92 325i rear rub, is the suspension getting old?



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-10-2019, 03:07 PM   #1
leeks
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
45
Posts

Drives: BMW 325i LCi
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

E92 325i rear rub, is the suspension getting old?

Dear all,

wanted some inputs from you guys. The car is a 2011 325i E92 with about 130,000 km.

Changed out to some new wheels:
Beyern Spartan 18"
8.5 ET30 front
9.5 ET25 rear

Since changing out to winter tires, I've been getting some rubs whilst going over huge bumps / potholes / rough roads. (rear only at least from the feelong and where the sound is coming from)

I've measured the ride height (from bottom of rim to fenders) and they measure (in cm):
Front left 62 (driver)
Front right 60
Rear left 60
Rear right 59.3 (battery)

Any ideas if I should look into replacing the bump stops or look into the suspension? I've attached the photos, sorry it's kinda dark.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Q1ZpSFCYbB9GCNPf9
https://photos.app.goo.gl/47LiBLNx7REhA1nW8

Reason I'm asking is that I'm looking to slowly swap out the suspension in phases or at one go to the B12 Pro Kit but I'm not sure I can lower the vehicle any more (and also that's not really my aim). I'm more aiming towards a more connected driving feel like when the car is new. Certainly a daily-driver. No tracking.

Thanks in advance to your inputs.

UPDATE:
*TIS seems to suggest ride height (with 10 mm tolerance):
front 619 mm
rear 596 mm

I obviously measured without any load (TIS says normal position is 2x 68kg on front seats, 14kg in boot and full fuel tank.

Apart from rolling the rear fenders, is there a practical way of safely raising the rear? I believe the rub is attributed to the rear wheel offset (ET25) + those bloody broad wall Michelin tires, should have gone for ET35 so wheels will be in the wheel well = (

Last edited by leeks; 12-13-2019 at 02:39 AM..
Appreciate 0
      12-13-2019, 10:19 AM   #2
feuer
Major General
feuer's Avatar
United_States
3073
Rep
7,176
Posts

Drives: wife crazy!
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (4)

Your e92 isn't lowered and you are experiencing rubbing. Although e30 pads might help that isn't the correct way of addressing the issue. Also you can try, alignment with more negative camber and of course rolled/pulled fenders. However, different wheels will be the correct remedy, less aggressive offset and smaller size tire.
Appreciate 1
Wolf 3351018.00

      12-13-2019, 02:41 PM   #3
Phil325i
Colonel
Phil325i's Avatar
United Kingdom
257
Rep
2,496
Posts

Drives: E92 325i MSport Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK South East

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Or you could have a small portion of the rear arches rolled. You'll see where the tyres are rubbing and what needs rolling. Worked for me when I changed wheels and added spacers...
__________________
E92 pre-LCI 325i - Ohlins R&T; H&R spacers; M3 strut brace; Swift thrust sheets; BMS clutch stop; BMS CDV; RE g/box mounts; Saikoumichi OCC; Cyba scoops; BMW Perf Exhaust; HEL s/steel brake hoses; M3 rear spoiler; Recaro Sportster CSs; M3 white dash LEDs; LED Angels; LED side repeaters; BMW Perf black grille; CSL reps; SSDD carbon diffuser; Monster Wrap black roof/clear front
Appreciate 0
      12-14-2019, 01:32 AM   #4
Soravia
First Lieutenant
United_States
50
Rep
370
Posts

Drives: 2011 E91 Silver xDrive 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Kentucky

iTrader: (0)

My 2011 with 60k has suspension dampers ALREADY BLOWN and rubber mounts have sag and compression. Suspension arm bushings are still there, adding tension and artificial spring rate to lift the car.

You MUST replace all your suspension parts, save the springs, unless they are rusted out. All control arm bushings included. When your tighten them to torque at neutral wheel position, they add spring rate due to their resistance. Cracked bushing will lower the car.
Appreciate 0
      12-15-2019, 03:44 AM   #5
leeks
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
45
Posts

Drives: BMW 325i LCi
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Mmmm. Define all suspension parts?
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 02:45 AM   #6
leeks
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
45
Posts

Drives: BMW 325i LCi
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by feuer View Post
Your e92 isn't lowered and you are experiencing rubbing. Although e30 pads might help that isn't the correct way of addressing the issue. Also you can try, alignment with more negative camber and of course rolled/pulled fenders. However, different wheels will be the correct remedy, less aggressive offset and smaller size tire.
Yeah I realised the mistake but it was too late after I ordered. Silly me followed someone else's suggestion who mentioned that it worked without any issues.

I guess I could do either of the following:
1) get new rears of ET35 (hence less aggressive)
2) roll fenders on the rear (not so keen since I don't know of any good workshops in my region)

Does everyone actively change out their suspension bushings/control arms etc? I checked the car last weekend (when lifted). I don't really see any play in any of the wheels, front/rear. Hard to justify changing it but would be keen to changing the control arms etc to those from the M3 (that can be found on FCPeuro)

@Phil325i did you roll those fenders "by eye" or is there a specific measurement you took?
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 08:16 AM   #7
Phil325i
Colonel
Phil325i's Avatar
United Kingdom
257
Rep
2,496
Posts

Drives: E92 325i MSport Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: UK South East

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by leeks View Post
@Phil325i did you roll those fenders "by eye" or is there a specific measurement you took?
It was done for me. But yes, I believe it was clear 'by eye' where the tyres were rubbing and only a small area of the lip needed folding under. Towards the rear of the arch as I recall...
__________________
E92 pre-LCI 325i - Ohlins R&T; H&R spacers; M3 strut brace; Swift thrust sheets; BMS clutch stop; BMS CDV; RE g/box mounts; Saikoumichi OCC; Cyba scoops; BMW Perf Exhaust; HEL s/steel brake hoses; M3 rear spoiler; Recaro Sportster CSs; M3 white dash LEDs; LED Angels; LED side repeaters; BMW Perf black grille; CSL reps; SSDD carbon diffuser; Monster Wrap black roof/clear front
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 10:19 AM   #8
leeks
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
45
Posts

Drives: BMW 325i LCi
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Well, the rub is quite minor but annoying enough for me to notice.

Would I be judged if I say I'd live with it until I get the suspensions changed out next year? OR would I be destroying the poor car?
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 11:27 AM   #9
Emilime75
Major
573
Rep
1,360
Posts

Drives: 2010 335i
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: X

iTrader: (1)

The problem is that your winter wheel spec is a little aggressive. 9.5 +25 pushes out about 22mm from the M Sport rears at 8.5 +34. That's the equivalent of putting 22mm spacers on the stock rear wheels.

What size are your rear tires?

Can you tell if it's rubbing on the metal quarter panel, or on the inner liner?

I'd be looking at adding some camber or rolling the quarters before adding height to the car.
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 02:11 PM   #10
Soravia
First Lieutenant
United_States
50
Rep
370
Posts

Drives: 2011 E91 Silver xDrive 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Kentucky

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by leeks View Post
Mmmm. Define all suspension parts?
Dampers, bump stops, rear top foam mounts, rear bottom mount, front top mount, control arms (worn bushings), and of course, single use fasteners.
All of them contribute to ride height and suspension control. On extreme cases, check for condition of anti sway bar link joints and their mounting metal clips for corrosion and leaks
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 03:43 PM   #11
feuer
Major General
feuer's Avatar
United_States
3073
Rep
7,176
Posts

Drives: wife crazy!
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soravia View Post
You MUST replace all your suspension parts
Quote:
Originally Posted by leeks View Post
Mmmm. Define all suspension parts?
Unless Soravia is joking that would be extremely stupid to do.
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 05:41 PM   #12
Soravia
First Lieutenant
United_States
50
Rep
370
Posts

Drives: 2011 E91 Silver xDrive 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Kentucky

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by feuer View Post
Unless Soravia is joking that would be extremely stupid to do.
What would YOU keep?
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 06:53 PM   #13
feuer
Major General
feuer's Avatar
United_States
3073
Rep
7,176
Posts

Drives: wife crazy!
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soravia View Post
What would YOU keep?
Keep what? From the suspension? What you are suggesting is stupid. Owner is better of replacing the whole vehicle at that point. Do you know much overhauling the complete suspension will cost? Even if is free isn't necessary lol. I would just get new wheels. Maybe shocks. Ends with that.
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 08:51 PM   #14
Soravia
First Lieutenant
United_States
50
Rep
370
Posts

Drives: 2011 E91 Silver xDrive 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Kentucky

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by feuer View Post
Keep what? From the suspension? What you are suggesting is stupid. Owner is better of replacing the whole vehicle at that point. Do you know much overhauling the complete suspension will cost? Even if is free isn't necessary lol. I would just get new wheels. Maybe shocks. Ends with that.
Cool! That's your idea.
And I call it "Stupid" in your own words.
Poster likes the wheels and obviously wants to keep them. Thus, looking to change out suspension. I point to worn out bushings being part of the cause that isn't helping with ride height.

One can get $700 or less spent on getting front AND back M3 control arms (new) with new bushings. Better handling, a bit more ride height if the original bushings are worn out.

Wheels can cost just as much if not more.

One cheap solution for OP is to get xDrive springs. They are taller and slightly stronger springs. It will definitely lift your car up. You can cut them down to size if too tall?

Last edited by Soravia; 12-16-2019 at 09:06 PM..
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 09:56 PM   #15
feuer
Major General
feuer's Avatar
United_States
3073
Rep
7,176
Posts

Drives: wife crazy!
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soravia View Post
Cool! That's your idea.
And I call it "Stupid" in your own words.
Poster likes the wheels and obviously wants to keep them. Thus, looking to change out suspension. I point to worn out bushings being part of the cause that isn't helping with ride height.

One can get $700 or less spent on getting front AND back M3 control arms (new) with new bushings. Better handling, a bit more ride height if the original bushings are worn out.

Wheels can cost just as much if not more.

One cheap solution for OP is to get xDrive springs. They are taller and slightly stronger springs. It will definitely lift your car up. You can cut them down to size if too tall?
You pointing out that bushings are warn out is exactly that, oh I don't want to use that word anymore....Click on the links. That e92 isn't sitting low at all, as you are suggesting it is due to warn bushings. Any car is riding on springs. Yeah, bushings are a factor, but negligible at best in this case. Owner of that e92 will spend their money listening to you only to find out that rubbing will be present again, as soon as they start driving aggressively, have people riding in the back and ect. Not very smart idea man, not very smart....
Appreciate 0
      12-16-2019, 10:34 PM   #16
Emilime75
Major
573
Rep
1,360
Posts

Drives: 2010 335i
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: X

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soravia View Post
Cool! That's your idea.
And I call it "Stupid" in your own words.
Poster likes the wheels and obviously wants to keep them. Thus, looking to change out suspension. I point to worn out bushings being part of the cause that isn't helping with ride height.

One can get $700 or less spent on getting front AND back M3 control arms (new) with new bushings. Better handling, a bit more ride height if the original bushings are worn out.

Wheels can cost just as much if not more.

One cheap solution for OP is to get xDrive springs. They are taller and slightly stronger springs. It will definitely lift your car up. You can cut them down to size if too tall?
Bushings are not the answer and control arm bushings are definitely not the answer. That would be $700 down the drain if the goal was to simply fix the tires from rubbing.

The problem is the wheel and tire spec. The fix is different wheels and/or tires, added camber or rolling the fenders.
Appreciate 2
feuer3072.50
leeks3.00

      12-17-2019, 02:36 AM   #17
leeks
Enlisted Member
3
Rep
45
Posts

Drives: BMW 325i LCi
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Fair enough! It is indeed a "user's fault" in this case, mine. I will look into changing out to the ET35 as recommended by the wheel manufacturer next year (it's a rather big investment). Thank you for enlightening ideas. Emilime75 and feuer

Soravia will look into updating the suspensions at a later time. Like I said, I don't see any play on all wheels. Checked the bushing yesterday after seeing what everyone has been saying and I don't see that they are terribly worn out.
Appreciate 1
feuer3072.50

Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:46 PM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST