[WilyB]

I have been manufacturing radar absorbing materials for the past 20+ years. Over the time, I received many inquiries as to whether we could reduce the radar cross section (RCS) of a moving vehicle in such a significant fashion as to reduce the detection range of the speed measuring radars.

The main elements involved in a car’s frontal RCS are:

- The license plate,
- The headlights,
- The vertical metallic surfaces (grill, radiator, engine etc.)
- The driver and anything inside.

As more and more of our market is now in the civilian field (medical and telecom industries), I have decided to do what people have been asking me over the years and check if it is doable to reduce the RCS of my 335 in a significant way.

I ordered a BMW E92 car bra and I will have it fitted with our lightweight, thin X to Ka band RAM. We also have a solution for the air vents. This material absorbs over 15dB (i-e over 95%) of the speed radar energy. In theory, this could translate to a range of detection reduced to up to 50 to 60%.

I am ordering a police radar gun. I might need some assistance to find an appropriate testing area (around Washington DC), ideally a long straight line with little traffic.

If the initial tests are positive, I will contact the people in the radar detector forums and conduct further testing with them.

Please note that at this stage, this is not a commercial endeavor. We have no idea of the cost and of the potential market, if any. If it turns into a marketable product, I will request to become a sponsor here. If not, I will just have the answer to the question many people have asked me over the years.

Note that passive RCS reduction is perfectly legal in the USA.

For our foreign friends, please note that:

- Only things in the public domain are going to be discussed here,
- You will not be able to purchase it.

I will update this thread as things move along. I do this for fun, and pesky customers will take priority over this project.

Last but not least, after careful consideration, I decided to post it in the electronic forum. I hope that was the right choice.

[rambino]

Woo hoo

what about us Europeans? My Valentine 1 set on Euro mode still doesnt pick up 80 percent of the Photo cameras out here so i just removed it.. no point.. I need help.. im sick of getting tickets in the mail for 6kmh over grrr

[theDude]

Awesome, I'm very curious to hear what you discover.

[jonm42]

Subscribed. Immediate notification!

[Bimmer335i07]

Originally Posted by jonm42

Subscribed. Immediate notification!

+1

This sounds interesting. Hope it works out.

[e92phreak]

Subscribed! Will be looking forward to updates.

[WilyB]

First of all, thanks for your kind comments, they are much appreciated!

The BMW car bra arrived today. I checked: it fits. It will be tomorrow at the factory where our engineers will determine the best way to add our RAM unto the bra.

Meanwhile, I shall order the radar gun, probably a K-band unit from Decatur, and preferably the battery operated handheld, otherwise I need a car attached to the gun.

Now, if I do have to have a car attached, and if I get a great deal on the dual K & Ka-band unit, I might be tempted. But then I would have to buy a Crown Victoria PI to install the unit…

Factory will take its time to turn the bra into a low observable device. As I mentioned before, pesky customers do come before fun projects.

[karliejai]

Subscribed

[TeeG]

subscribed, too!

[wesley_willis]

subscribed

[cmega412]

Wow!!! Thanks for doing all this, I don't think I could leave my bra on there at all time cause I don't know about the way it looks, but on a rally this would be sick, also protect you from all the god damn rocks and such. Thanks for all the information.

[XPO186]

now this is a cool project... keep us posted!

[rrandyy]

I rather get a speeding ticket or not speed than put a bra like that on my car....

[RichP]

Originally Posted by rrandyy

I rather get a speeding ticket or not speed than put a bra like that on my car....

While I dont like the look of a car bra either..this would be a great thing for long distance trips: protects the car from road debris AND radar!

[Neema]

Originally Posted by rrandyy

I rather get a speeding ticket or not speed than put a bra like that on my car....

i believe he said "Factory will take its time to turn the bra into a low observable device." But I wouldnt want a bra like that on either

[WilyB]

Originally Posted by rrandyy

I rather get a speeding ticket or not speed than put a bra like that on my car....

I perfectly understand your position. I choose the bra from BMW itself to make sure the fit and finish will be up to our expectations.

I expect the bra will be done in a month or so. Then the fun part – testing – will start!

[doc1911]

I don't want to rain on your parade but I have a question. I just got back from a business trip working with the NY State Police. I asked about radar detection, speed traps, tickets... etc (know your enemy!). I was told that almost all significant (nationwide) PD's are going to a laser instead of a radar (Barney Fife probably doesn't have the dough). The laser is instant and by the time you see it they already have you. No good versus a traditional radar detector.

Will your project work against a laser? If not you may want to look into that so it will not be obsolete in a couple years.

Ranbino--Just a guess but the cameras over there might work off a laser system, I don't know?

[WilyB]

While you ar right about State PDs, many speed traps are manned by local LEOs, with simple radar speed guns (it provides a significant percentage of the local municipalities’ revenues!)

About lasers, black, preferably matt black, is the worst reflector. On a dark car, LEOs are trained to target the license plates, and if you do not have a license plate, or have a non reflective cover on it, they try to get the headlights. On the 335, the headlights are very tiny.

Reducing the RCS, or rather in that case - your laser reflectivity - enhances your counter-measures.

There are many available – and legal – laser scramblers. The less light your car reflects, the better the scrambler scrambles!

If you have a good working relationship with NY State Police, I might be interested in testing my project against their equipment?

[doba_s]

Subscribed!

[de.abeja]

I remember when the yard installed similar stuff on our ship when I was in the Navy, I was trying to think of a way to install it on my civic back in 1996, we had the thick and thin foam based product and another clear one installed on the bridge windows.

Is your product similar on composition to the military coverings?

[WilyB]

Originally Posted by de.abeja

Is your product similar on composition to the military coverings?

No, it is not. It is two generation beyond foam. It is much more robust, much thinner and flexible enough to make BDUs out of it.

[michaeljr6]

hmmmm seems interesting. can't wait to see the finish product