[Brettb1234]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

The Castro Edge 5w40/0w30/0w40 at walmart is only LL-01 recommended not approved. Is there any Castro oil that has BMW LL-01 approval? Local NAPA stocks LiquiMolly LL-04 approved oil but those go for $8-9 per quart/liter.

Search "Castrol LL-01" on Amazon. They have both 5w-30 and 0w-40 that are both LL-01 approved.

Your recommended not approved statement makes zero sense?

[Brettb1234]

Originally Posted by Cory S

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00JGQLZSU/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1457886999&sr=8-1&pi=SY200_QL40&keywords=castrol+edge+LL-01&dpPl=1&dpID=51c%2BUHB-jCL&ref=plSrch

This goes on sale for $25.xx a jug about once a week on Anazon, but you can also find them at certain Walmarts for the same sale price.

Just picked up 2 jugs for just under $23 each on Amazon

[Cory S]

Originally Posted by Brettb1234

Just picked up 2 jugs for just under $23 each on Amazon

Always happens to me. Purchase something for XXX amount, and the next day, it drops even more....

[John 070]

Originally Posted by Cory S

Always happens to me. Purchase something for XXX amount, and the next day, it drops even more....

Some vendors are very good about it, amazon is not one of them (7-day policy?)

I bought a new ThinkPad for like $1628, it dropped 6X to $1573, I got 6 credits. Today, it is $1728. Also odd is it has a 5th gen corei7 and the 6th gen is out, but I don't think this ultrabook has it yet, or I could be wrong.

Usually with tech, we expect prices to go down over time, in many cases, not so....

[3.1L Z]

It's interesting to chat, argue and banter back and forth about motor oil. It's cool. I like to engage.....I've read a lot on oils and been on a few forums outside of the N54 world. I have 260z stroked to 3.1 which by design has flat tappet style overhead cam lifters. When this car was produced (1974) engine oil was very very different than the oil of today. Older cars are often subject to oil arguments by an even bigger degree than current cars since the "old" oil is not around anymore. Motors like the Z motor and Detroit OHV flat tappet style ones originally ran with higher levels of Zinc since no pollution controls were around back then. Oils have gotten cleaner and same goes for the fuel. I've read plenty of posts about running diesel oil due to the higher zinc content etc....If you really want to dig in read the link below. I don't take this as the "guide" by any means but if you judge your source by size of the pure data you're going to love this write up. This guy tests oil by its film strength which is its ability to remain between the two metal parts to prevents actual contact and wear which would follow....Surprising results... Levels of. Zinc and diesel oil are not the best. Read this when you have 2 hours....

BTW...The Rotella T6 diesel oil that some folks rave about on this forum ranked in the bottom 20% for film strength.

https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/201...-test-ranking/

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by Brettb1234

Search "Castrol LL-01" on Amazon. They have both 5w-30 and 0w-40 that are both LL-01 approved.

Your recommended not approved statement makes zero sense?

Read the label of the Castrol bottle, e.g. 0w30 and 0w40 say:

"Castrol Edge with SYNTEC Power Technology exceeds tough industry standards", and it lists BMW LL-01 as one of the standards.

These are not OEM approved, namely, they are not sent to BMW labs to be certified.

Mobil 1 0w40 used to be label LL-01 approved, but the new 0w40 did not pass BMW's LL-01 test, hence the label is changed.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by Brettb1234

Search "Castrol LL-01" on Amazon. They have both 5w-30 and 0w-40 that are both LL-01 approved.

Your recommended not approved statement makes zero sense?

Also, check this out for Castrol EDGE Professional LL-01 5w40.

http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/2630DB0B1035EB5780257DE200380515/$File/BPXE-9U7KKH.pdf

It clearly states:

Product Performance Claims: BMW LL-01.

So basically the manufacturer wants the customers to believe their claim that the oil exceeds BMW's spec, without BMW acknowledging that claim.

Does it make sense now?

[VTECaddict]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Read the label of the Castrol bottle, e.g. 0w30 and 0w40 say:

"Castrol Edge with SYNTEC Power Technology exceeds tough industry standards", and it lists BMW LL-01 as one of the standards.

These are not OEM approved, namely, they are not sent to BMW labs to be certified.

Mobil 1 0w40 used to be label LL-01 approved, but the new 0w40 did not pass BMW's LL-01 test, hence the label is changed.

No. You're reading way too much into it and trying to read non-existent text between the lines. If it lists LL-01 as a spec on the bottle regardless of the actual word "approved" being printed on it or not, it is tested and approved to meet LL-01 specs.

BMW has in fact previously listed Castrol Syntec European Formula 0w30 as a LL-01 approved and recommended oil on their own website, despite your claims of it not being "approved" because of the text on the bottle. The only reason they don't list it anymore is they have removed ALL third party oil recommendations and only recommend their own BMW branded oil, but that doesn't change the fact it's an LL-01 approved oil.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

No. You're reading way too much into it and trying to read non-existent text between the lines. If it lists LL-01 as a spec on the bottle regardless of the actual word "approved" being printed on it or not, it is tested and approved to meet LL-01 specs.

BMW has in fact previously listed Castrol Syntec European Formula 0w30 as a LL-01 approved and recommended oil on their own website, despite your claims of it not being "approved" because of the text on the bottle. The only reason they don't list it anymore is they have removed ALL third party oil recommendations and only recommend their own BMW branded oil, but that doesn't change the fact it's an LL-01 approved oil.

All oils recommended by BMW are tested and approved by BMW, and those are marked with LL-01 approval at back labels. In fact, the previous gen of Mobil 1 0w40 is still LL-01 approved, but the latest, newly formulated Mobil 1 FS 0w40 is not LL-01 approved. Do note that the "FS" logo is small, but it is on the bottle. Unfortunately Walmart has pulled most of the old Mobil 1 0w40 off the shelf, and only the Mobil 1 FS 0w40 is currently available.

[VTECaddict]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

All oils recommended by BMW are tested and approved by BMW, and those are marked with LL-01 approval at back labels.

Exactly, approved oils are marked with LL-01. So what are you trying to say about Castrol not being approved? If it says BMW LL-01 on the label, it's LL-01 approved.

BMW used to list approved oils on their website here: http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...ngineOils.aspx. They have since taken that page down and only recommend their own BMW branded oil without mentioning any third party oils, despite many third party oils carrying LL-01 approval.

My point is BMW themselves listed "Castrol Syntec European Formula SAE 0w-30" as being BMW LL-01 approved, a fact that you claim is false. This PDF shows what used to be on that above website, clearly saying the approval: http://www.bimmerfile.com/wp-content...hetic-oils.pdf

Also, in the same PDS you linked above from Castrol, it specifically states "Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40 lubricant."

Your whole theory of Castrol trying to claim approval when it doesn't have it is completely wrong so stop spreading your "recommended but not approved" misinformation.

[VTECaddict]

If you need more evidence, http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/73A258BA225A396680257D03006D47BE/$File/EDGE%20US%20PDS.pdf

"Industry Specifications and OEM Approvals by Grade:"

Note that 0w30, 0w40, and 5w40 grades are marked off next to BMW LL-01.

[John 070]

What I did find interesting in my own online research was that BMW is so specific nowadays, that a 320i uses a different oil than a 328i.....

M's have always been different, but it didn't used to get into 320 vs 328 etc.

Personally, even out of warranty, I would stick to LL-01...and it's a shame if you can't get any at Walmart, imho $8/qt. is a rip-off....

also funny how the 01 is 2001....

[John 070]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

No. You're reading way too much into it and trying to read non-existent text between the lines. If it lists LL-01 as a spec on the bottle regardless of the actual word "approved" being printed on it or not, it is tested and approved to meet LL-01 specs.

BMW has in fact previously listed Castrol Syntec European Formula 0w30 as a LL-01 approved and recommended oil on their own website, despite your claims of it not being "approved" because of the text on the bottle. The only reason they don't list it anymore is they have removed ALL third party oil recommendations and only recommend their own BMW branded oil, but that doesn't change the fact it's an LL-01 approved oil.

I just read it and it uses the word required, so I'm with you.

Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40
lubricant

I also do know there is a lot of trickery these days...one example I can think of, is GM "licensing" 3rd parties to offer extended warranties on GM cars, when the 3rd parties are in no way affiliated with GM, using the GM logo etc. That's pretty shady imho, because the said 3rd parties act like it's coming from GM.

wth I just reread the document with 3D glasses:

Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved by the Three Stooges, for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40. Although the Three Stooges has approved the use, BMW has not.

[barefootin]

Originally Posted by 3.1L Z

It's interesting to chat, argue and banter back and forth about motor oil. It's cool. I like to engage.....I've read a lot on oils and been on a few forums outside of the N54 world. I have 260z stroked to 3.1 which by design has flat tappet style overhead cam lifters. When this car was produced (1974) engine oil was very very different than the oil of today. Older cars are often subject to oil arguments by an even bigger degree than current cars since the "old" oil is not around anymore. Motors like the Z motor and Detroit OHV flat tappet style ones originally ran with higher levels of Zinc since no pollution controls were around back then. Oils have gotten cleaner and same goes for the fuel.
BTW...The Rotella T6 diesel oil that some folks rave about on this forum ranked in the bottom 20% for film strength.

https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/201...-test-ranking/

At least those bantering back and forth in this post understand they need to change their oil... I've encountered too many people that think engine oil is a "life of vehicle" lubricant

Just like cars, women, clothing, beer, etc... Everyone has an opinion based on something, and this is the internet where everything must be scrutinized. My basis for T6 usage is based on oil analysis, personal fleet longevity, and wear properties of motors I have torn down for additional performance upgrades. My disdain for M1 is based on similar. Their w40's perform in hot temp's like w20's and w30's of other manufacturers carrying little oil pressure at hot idle or at hot rpm and even causing start up noise (turbos and lifters) due to little to no residual film after shutdown. In my "rotary" phase of life (RX4's and RX7's), T6 and Syntec lowered oil and coolant temps over other oils. The only oil I hate more is QS due its ability to coak up an engine. Besides, anything that comes out of a new container darker than the T6 or Syntec oil being drained out after 3-5K on it, is just not going in my vehicles... Of course, all of this is strictly my opinion. Anything resembling facts are purely coincidental...


In my flat tappet cars, regardless of oil choice I run additional zinc. Of course mine still require leaded fuel with min 98RON...


I had a 240z for a short time, since almost anything with multiple side draft carbs is cool

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by John 070

I just read it and it uses the word required, so I'm with you.

Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40
lubricant

I also do know there is a lot of trickery these days...one example I can think of, is GM "licensing" 3rd parties to offer extended warranties on GM cars, when the 3rd parties are in no way affiliated with GM, using the GM logo etc. That's pretty shady imho, because the said 3rd parties act like it's coming from GM.

wth I just reread the document with 3D glasses:

Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved by the Three Stooges, for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40. Although the Three Stooges has approved the use, BMW has not.

Castrol Edge Syntec SAE 0w30 European Formula from Walmart is a black bottle with "exceeds tough industrial standards" in back label. That oil is LL-01 recommended by Castrol, not approved by BMW.

Castrol Edge Professional OE 0w40 is a gold bottle, and is LL-01 approved by BMW. It is the original re-branded BW high performance 5w30 oil(the BMW oil is a heavy w30). It says "exclusive OEM formulation" on the box of 6.

"Castrol EDGE Professional is endorsed and recommended by our OEM partners: Audi, BMW, Jaguar, Land Rover, Mazda, Mini, Volkswagen and Volvo. It is also available to any new car dealership."

http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/4ABA633F17A143FD80257AA90053665B/$File/EDGE%20Professional%20European%20PDS_July_2012.pdf

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

Exactly, approved oils are marked with LL-01. So what are you trying to say about Castrol not being approved? If it says BMW LL-01 on the label, it's LL-01 approved.

BMW used to list approved oils on their website here: http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...ngineOils.aspx. They have since taken that page down and only recommend their own BMW branded oil without mentioning any third party oils, despite many third party oils carrying LL-01 approval.

My point is BMW themselves listed "Castrol Syntec European Formula SAE 0w-30" as being BMW LL-01 approved, a fact that you claim is false. This PDF shows what used to be on that above website, clearly saying the approval: http://www.bimmerfile.com/wp-content...hetic-oils.pdf

Also, in the same PDS you linked above from Castrol, it specifically states "Castrol EDGE Professional LL01 5W-40 is approved for use in vehicles that require a BMW Longlife-01 approved 5W-40 lubricant."

Your whole theory of Castrol trying to claim approval when it doesn't have it is completely wrong so stop spreading your "recommended but not approved" misinformation.

My claim is accurate, and there is no misinformation spread in my posts.

To be specific, the Castrol Edge Professional OE(gold bottle) is LL-01 approved by BMW, but not the Castro Edge(black bottle) from Walmart. If you purchase black bottles from Walmart, you can refund those and get the real ones from the dealers or Amazon.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by barefootin

At least those bantering back and forth in this post understand they need to change their oil... I've encountered too many people that think engine oil is a "life of vehicle" lubricant

Just like cars, women, clothing, beer, etc... Everyone has an opinion based on something, and this is the internet where everything must be scrutinized. My basis for T6 usage is based on oil analysis, personal fleet longevity, and wear properties of motors I have torn down for additional performance upgrades. My disdain for M1 is based on similar. Their w40's perform in hot temp's like w20's and w30's of other manufacturers carrying little oil pressure at hot idle or at hot rpm and even causing start up noise (turbos and lifters) due to little to no residual film after shutdown. In my "rotary" phase of life (RX4's and RX7's), T6 and Syntec lowered oil and coolant temps over other oils. The only oil I hate more is QS due its ability to coak up an engine. Besides, anything that comes out of a new container darker than the T6 or Syntec oil being drained out after 3-5K on it, is just not going in my vehicles... Of course, all of this is strictly my opinion. Anything resembling facts are purely coincidental...


In my flat tappet cars, regardless of oil choice I run additional zinc. Of course mine still require leaded fuel with min 98RON...


I had a 240z for a short time, since almost anything with multiple side draft carbs is cool

Your experience with M1 0w40 matches mine(noisy). The Castrol Edge Professional OE and BMW High Performance 5w30 work out better for my bimmers than M1 0w40. BTW, a friend with Porsches swears by M1 0w40, so my entire stockpile was sold to him.

[VTECaddict]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Castrol Edge Syntec SAE 0w30 European Formula from Walmart is a black bottle with "exceeds tough industrial standards" in back label. That oil is LL-01 recommended by Castrol, not approved by BMW.

Did you not see the PDF I linked that used to be on BMW's own website that BMW themselves specifically states is approved for used in LL-01 required engines?

[VTECaddict]

Originally Posted by John 070

What I did find interesting in my own online research was that BMW is so specific nowadays, that a 320i uses a different oil than a 328i.....

M's have always been different, but it didn't used to get into 320 vs 328 etc.

Personally, even out of warranty, I would stick to LL-01...and it's a shame if you can't get any at Walmart, imho $8/qt. is a rip-off....

also funny how the 01 is 2001....

I suspect that's part of the reason why BMW has removed third party oil recommendations from their website. It's too confusing now with different oils for different engine lines, and the new Bxx engines are now requiring 0W20 LL-14FE oil

[VTECaddict]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Also, check this out for Castrol EDGE Professional LL-01 5w40.

http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/2630DB0B1035EB5780257DE200380515/$File/BPXE-9U7KKH.pdf

It clearly states:

Product Performance Claims: BMW LL-01.

So basically the manufacturer wants the customers to believe their claim that the oil exceeds BMW's spec, without BMW acknowledging that claim.

Does it make sense now?

Originally Posted by bavarianride

My claim is accurate, and there is no misinformation spread in my posts.

To be specific, the Castrol Edge Professional OE(gold bottle) is LL-01 approved by BMW, but not the Castro Edge(black bottle) from Walmart. If you purchase black bottles from Walmart, you can refund those and get the real ones from the dealers or Amazon.

First you said the Castrol EDGE Professional LL-01 5w40 is just "claimed" to meet LL-01. Now you say that same oil is in fact "BMW approved".

The PDS for Castrol EDGE I linked above clearly marked off OEM approval for BMW LL-01 on 0W30 and 0W40, which is indeed the black bottles.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

First you said the Castrol EDGE Professional LL-01 5w40 is just "claimed" to meet LL-01. Now you say that same oil is in fact "BMW approved".

The PDS for Castrol EDGE I linked above clearly marked off OEM approval for BMW LL-01 on 0W30 and 0W40, which is indeed the black bottles.

The Edge Professional and Edge Professional OE are two different bottles. The Edge Professional OE is the one sold at dealers, not Edge Professional. And the Edge Professional OE spec sheet clearly says the oils is endorsed and recommended by BMW, and it only lists 0w40 and 5w40 as LL-01 approved, while the 5w30 is not LL-01 approved. There is no ambiguous description of "approval" and then product specification "claims" in the Professional OE spec sheet.

And given that the sales prices for the Professional OE bottles were not that more expensive than Professional($5-6/bottle for my stockpile, from local indy which has since closed), there was no reason for me not to get the OE ones.

Now the question is, are Edge and Edge Professional OE the same oil? From the spec sheets of the two oils, the numbers are close, except for one entry, namely viscosity 210F SUS, so that is one piece of fact/evidence to show they are different oils.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

Did you not see the PDF I linked that used to be on BMW's own website that BMW themselves specifically states is approved for used in LL-01 required engines?

That list of BMW approved oils is dated 2008, and my understanding is that the list has since been updated. Also note that the list says Castrol 5w30, but Castrol Edge Professional OE spec sheet no longer lists 5w30 as LL-01(it only lists 0w40 and 5w40 as LL-01).