[Chief Orman]

What year do you recommend...I want spend well under 30K and I want it heavily optioned. Won't do a delete so I am thinking about the single turbo mill. Any thoughts on how the emissions equipment may have improved since my 2010 335d would be appreciated. I checked out the X5 board but it is pretty weak.

[BB_cuda]

I'll bite. I presume you want something fairly new if you're willing to spend up to 30 grand. The older E70 X5d runs up through 2013. We have a June 2013 produced E70 (last month of the run). 2014 started the F15 X5d with the newer N57 engine. It has single turbo and the much more loved 8 speed transmission. There is a guy that is doing F15 tunes named Dmitry (i know i spelled that wrong). One thing that was a downgrade for th newer N57. They got a Cp4 instead of CP3 HP injection pump. The CP3 is more durable i hear. There are several that have deleted the N57 and seem pretty happy. I'm not familiar with the downpipes and such used here. Some one should be along soon otherwise I will get someone over from FB NABDOG as i know they are over there. Good Luck.

[Chief Orman]

helpful...thank you

[Mik325tds]

I have a 2011. Just the standard issues. My SCR tank got replaced under warranty. Strangely, I'm having several issues with wiring harness rotting. My rear PDC harness probably got damaged when they installed the trailer hitch. But wheel speed sensor front left and PDC sensor front now also have issues.
Engine wise everything is fine.

[lnxguy]

You'd take a F15 with the CP4 over a E70 with the CP3? Ehh......

[apexit4]

If you want a heavily optioned X5D AND spend well under 30k, you're just about limiting your options to only an E70. I just bought a 2012 X5D last week and most of the F15's I came across in my budget (25k or under) just didn't have the options I wanted.

Dont forget that the E70's have an extended warranty on the NOx sensors and SCR to 10 years or 120k miles. That should give you some peace of mind for a couple years or so.

[robnitro]

2011 and up is better because of the CIC and the updates like LED lights.

[BB_cuda]

Originally Posted by robnitro

2011 and up is better because of the CIC and the updates like LED lights.

Yes, 2011 is when the LCI upgrade for E70s happened.

[W37V]

I got (f15) 2015 X5 35d. It's an awesome vehicle. I test drove e70 (considered buying it several times) and f15. F15 is much more refined than e70. E70 diesel sounds and feels like a diesel truck - clutter and all. F15 sounds like any modern direct injection engine. You would never think it is a diesel unless you knew what to listen for or look for.

If fuel economy is important to you, then def get f15. My average is over 32mpg (lots of stop and go traffic). The best I achieved was over 42mpg. From my numerous conversations with other E70 owners, many said that their best tank was high 20's. One guy claimed he got 31 pure hwy driving.

M57 is a tank and reliable if you do deletes, but N57 does appear to be reliable engine as well. There are not many complaints about that engine on f15 post. I personally had issue with bad DEF, but other than that - no issues at all for over 20k miles.
However, it is worth noting: on n47 or n57 injectors do tend to go bad. They are not prohibitively expensive to replace (~$130 each). Also, there might be some carbon build up. I say might, as I haven't seen any posts about it being an issue.

Hopefully, this is helpful.

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by W37V

I got (f15) 2015 X5 35d. It's an awesome vehicle. I test drove e70 (considered buying it several times) and f15. F15 is much more refined than e70. E70 diesel sounds and feels like a diesel truck - clutter and all. F15 sounds like any modern direct injection engine. You would never think it is a diesel unless you knew what to listen for or look for.

If fuel economy is important to you, then def get f15. My average is over 32mpg (lots of stop and go traffic). The best I achieved was over 42mpg. From my numerous conversations with other E70 owners, many said that their best tank was high 20's. One guy claimed he got 31 pure hwy driving.

M57 is a tank and reliable if you do deletes, but N57 does appear to be reliable engine as well. There are not many complaints about that engine on f15 post. I personally had issue with bad DEF, but other than that - no issues at all for over 20k miles.
However, it is worth noting: on n47 or n57 injectors do tend to go bad. They are not prohibitively expensive to replace (~$130 each). Also, there might be some carbon build up. I say might, as I haven't seen any posts about it being an issue.

Hopefully, this is helpful.

You forgot to mention the main issue with the n57- the cp4 pump. If it dies, it can take out the entire fuel system.

I agree on fuel mileage though, the f15 will always be better than the e70. I've got a tank of 31.6 confirmed on fuelly, pure highway, and a tank of 31.4 that included a trip into NYC. I'm currently on a 350 mile tank of commuting and around town errands, probably 40% around town and 60% highway and driving carefully, I'm bouncing between 29.7 and 30.1. And I'm on very aggressive winter tires (nokians) on "winter blend"(Which I've never noticed a difference in mileage for anyway.) My average below is only 26.3 as I've done about 5 or 6k miles of towing up to 7klbs around, so it lowered the lifetime average of the car. I average 27.5-28 without towing in the average, I did the math when I had owned the car for a year. I'm also fully deleted.
Good mileage is certainly possible on the e70, but for the same driving habits, the 8 speed trans will ALWAYS trump it in mpg.

[RL18]

Doesn't the n57 have a vgt turbo too? With emissions equipment vgts get pretty gunked up and the veins will stick.

I heard that with the cp4s atleast in the HD trucks most failures are due to straining the pump from asking for too much fuel and the pump has to work super hard, so lots of guys will install a prepump like fass, air dog, etc.. or they die from lack of lubrication in the fuel, which the US is known for not having lubrications in their diesel like other countries, so lots of guys swear by using additives that help increase lubricity.

Other than that they seem to be quite reliable, just fragile lol. But if you're that paranoid about the cp4, I can't imagine a conversion kit for going from a cp4->cp3 is impossible.

[W37V]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

You forgot to mention the main issue with the n57- the cp4 pump. If it dies, it can take out the entire fuel system.

I agree on fuel mileage though, the f15 will always be better than the e70. I've got a tank of 31.6 confirmed on fuelly, pure highway, and a tank of 31.4 that included a trip into NYC. I'm currently on a 350 mile tank of commuting and around town errands, probably 40% around town and 60% highway and driving carefully, I'm bouncing between 29.7 and 30.1. And I'm on very aggressive winter tires (nokians) on "winter blend"(Which I've never noticed a difference in mileage for anyway.) My average below is only 26.3 as I've done about 5 or 6k miles of towing up to 7klbs around, so it lowered the lifetime average of the car. I average 27.5-28 without towing in the average, I did the math when I had owned the car for a year. I'm also fully deleted.
Good mileage is certainly possible on the e70, but for the same driving habits, the 8 speed trans will ALWAYS trump it in mpg.

This was the first time I actually saw anything about HPFP on N57. I just did a quick google search, and most BMW failures were from 2014 535d. There were few 328d reported failures from early production years as well

General google search revealed that a lot of CP4 failures were on domestic vehicles. Considering that BMW used this pump on pretty much all of their diesel engines from 2011+, I really expected shitload of reported failures. However, there are only handful of them. Most failures were within 40k miles. Also, it seems that there is higher failure rate with CP4.1 version of the pump. BMW uses CP4.2 in later year production vehicles.

But damn... Now I need to figure out how to check if I have CP4.1 or newer CP4.2 pump. Any advice?

EDIT: It seems like most failures are contributed to the pump working extra hard. X5's have fuel tank (lift) pump which feeds fuel to HPFP, thus potentially reducing chances of failures.

Source:
https://www.dieseltechmag.com/2017/1...articleContent
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=16_0659

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by RL18

Doesn't the n57 have a vgt turbo too? With emissions equipment vgts get pretty gunked up and the veins will stick.

I heard that with the cp4s atleast in the HD trucks most failures are due to straining the pump from asking for too much fuel and the pump has to work super hard, so lots of guys will install a prepump like fass, air dog, etc.. or they die from lack of lubrication in the fuel, which the US is known for not having lubrications in their diesel like other countries, so lots of guys swear by using additives that help increase lubricity.

Other than that they seem to be quite reliable, just fragile lol. But if you're that paranoid about the cp4, I can't imagine a conversion kit for going from a cp4->cp3 is impossible.

Nothing is impossible with enough time and money- but I haven't heard of a conversion being done yet. To be honest, I'd likely use some additives if I had the cp4, every other or every 3rd tank. With my cp3, I don't hesitate to run the cheapest #2 I can find that isn't currently getting filled by a tanker. One day I might afford a nice f15, and I probably wouldnt pay MUCH mind to the cp4. But in the back of my head, I know that the failures are possible. Kind of like the n54 eating belts and tossing them into the crankshaft seals.... Very rare failure in the big picture, but definitely DOES occur.

[RL18]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

Other than that they seem to be quite reliable, just fragile lol. But if you're that paranoid about the cp4, I can't imagine a conversion kit for going from a cp4->cp3 is impossible.

Nothing is impossible with enough time and money- but I haven't heard of a conversion being done yet. To be honest, I'd likely use some additives if I had the cp4, every other or every 3rd tank. With my cp3, I don't hesitate to run the cheapest #2 I can find that isn't currently getting filled by a tanker. One day I might afford a nice f15, and I probably wouldnt pay MUCH mind to the cp4. But in the back of my head, I know that the failures are possible. Kind of like the n54 eating belts and tossing them into the crankshaft seals.... Very rare failure in the big picture, but definitely DOES occur.[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure how I feel about the f15 x5d... I love the looks of it, not sure how the driving is, but that 8sp is a huge upgrade even though the n57 doesn't make serious power like the m57 does in stock form. I've seen a newer 535d with an n57 that converted to a turbo set up like ours with hybrids and it made some serious power, something like 550hp and gobs of torque. For me that's what I'd probably need to be happy with it.

I'm fairly confident the cp4 is something that'll last if you take care of it. Like you say run additives ever once in awhile. I love my 2011 x5d though, maybe more than my 335d lol. I wish it had the 8speed but can't have everything

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by RL18

I'm not sure how I feel about the f15 x5d... I love the looks of it, not sure how the driving is, but that 8sp is a huge upgrade even though the n57 doesn't make serious power like the m57 does in stock form. I've seen a newer 535d with an n57 that converted to a turbo set up like ours with hybrids and it made some serious power, something like 550hp and gobs of torque. For me that's what I'd probably need to be happy with it.

I'm fairly confident the cp4 is something that'll last if you take care of it. Like you say run additives ever once in awhile. I love my 2011 x5d though, maybe more than my 335d lol. I wish it had the 8speed but can't have everything

8 speed is SUCH an upgrade, for sure. DUDMD is tuning n57's stage 2, at 310 whp and nearly 540ftlbs of torque at the wheels. I'm sure my m57 has a LITTLE more power than that, but likely about the exact same torque with a stage 2 tune from the same place. One day I'd love hybrids on my m57, but I'd rather spend a bit on money and get 34 mpg at 75mph cruising and maybe a tq converter, than go for big power. for now. I don't NEED more power, but it'd be fun.

Plus with hybrids you shouldn't lose much, if any efficiency at cruise, so maybe one day I can have both!

[RL18]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

l
8 speed is SUCH an upgrade, for sure. DUDMD is tuning n57's stage 2, at 310 whp and nearly 540ftlbs of torque at the wheels. I'm sure my m57 has a LITTLE more power than that, but likely about the exact same torque with a stage 2 tune from the same place. One day I'd love hybrids on my m57, but I'd rather spend a bit on money and get 34 mpg at 75mph cruising and maybe a tq converter, than go for big power. for now. I don't NEED more power, but it'd be fun.

Plus with hybrids you shouldn't lose much, if any efficiency at cruise, so maybe one day I can have both!

Is that 310whp with awd or rear wheel drive? You should be able to get 360whp rear wheel in a tuned m57 anyways and be above 300whp awd drive. The n57 is still impressive but I hate the turbo sound... I'd rather listen to my jet engine

Nice thing about diesels is the more power you make the more fuel efficient it is! I'd love to do a hybrid lp turbo on my x5d, which should get me 400whp awd, but I'm worried how the drivetrain would react. Funny how I buy my x5d as my DD so I can build my 335d but now I'd rather put more power to my x5d...

[Spyro235]

Originally Posted by RL18

Is that 310whp with awd or rear wheel drive? You should be able to get 360whp rear wheel in a tuned m57 anyways and be above 300whp awd drive. The n57 is still impressive but I hate the turbo sound... I'd rather listen to my jet engine

Nice thing about diesels is the more power you make the more fuel efficient it is! I'd love to do a hybrid lp turbo on my x5d, which should get me 400whp awd, but I'm worried how the drivetrain would react. Funny how I buy my x5d as my DD so I can build my 335d but now I'd rather put more power to my x5d...

Rear wheel, most likely. X5'd are entertaining vehicles to hustle around.

[RL18]

Originally Posted by Spyro235

Rear wheel, most likely. X5'd are entertaining vehicles to hustle around.

Yeah that makes sense, which is why I'd rather have the m57. The 6spd is still very good just not as good as the 8spd.

[11_335D]

Chief,
I recommend the F15 X5D over E70 X5D. You can definitely find a nice 2014+ in your budget you just have to search or perhaps wait for them. I bought my 2014 with 125k miles late nov 2017 and now has ~170k without any issues. My 2011 335D(basically the same as e70) is a different story. The 8spd trans is perfectly matched with the engine, I get ~33mpg with mixed 30%city/70%hwy driving. The newer tech and design won me over the e70 which is becoming a little dated looking now. My cars are stock no tunes or deletes. BMW recently replaced the egr cooler and intake manifold under a recall/TSB even though nothing was wrong with it and I had well over the 120k mile limit. I truly think these things could run forever with proper routine maintenance.

[RL18]

Originally Posted by 11_335D

Chief,
I recommend the F15 X5D over E70 X5D. You can definitely find a nice 2014+ in your budget you just have to search or perhaps wait for them. I bought my 2014 with 125k miles late nov 2017 and now has ~170k without any issues. My 2011 335D(basically the same as e70) is a different story. The 8spd trans is perfectly matched with the engine, I get ~33mpg with mixed 30%city/70%hwy driving. The newer tech and design won me over the e70 which is becoming a little dated looking now. My cars are stock no tunes or deletes. BMW recently replaced the egr cooler and intake manifold under a recall/TSB even though nothing was wrong with it and I had well over the 120k mile limit. I truly think these things could run forever with proper routine maintenance.

That's awesome to hear! I can imagine the reliability would increase with deletes? That fuel mileage is pretty amazing too

[BB_cuda]

Chief, did you ever buy an X5D?

[Chief Orman]

Originally Posted by BB_cuda

Chief, did you ever buy an X5D?

no