[Tambohamilton]

You guys must have special non-abrasive roads

The one thing that is specific to BMWs, but not included in the specs that standard tyre machines/software pulls up, is that the car has to be loaded with specific weights (which should achieve a certain ride height) while the geometry is set. Otherwise the setup will be incorrect (if factory geo is set with the car at unladen ride height). The weighting is something like 70kg in each front seat, 50kg in the rear centre, and 30kg in the boot/trunk centre.

[oVeRdOsE.]

Originally Posted by MightyMouseTech

As a BMW alignment tech......wut???

subframe was off. The guy unbolt all the bolts.

What you need more ?

the reason ? I dont know, loose bolt? non loose bolt and bushing was squeezed ?

The car was hit hard in pot hole.

you know at the rear you have 1 bolt at the control harm to adjust the car right? If my 2 rear wheels are not squared with the font , impossible to get the car straight.

not a rare issue on audi and bmw. get your car on a curb, and the sub frame is shifted. People who dont know shit about those car, wont be able to align it the right way. And it was my case, loosing 3 days and money until a shop where the owner owned about 40 bmw explained it to me. Sorry if the word I used are not bmw tech wise.

not surprised to see people making fun of it, glad for you , you don't live in a country who got 3rd world country road, and most of you get the car straight with the classic : Front & rear camber; front & rear toe ;thrust angle



https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1506694

[CTinline-six]

Originally Posted by oVeRdOsE.

subframe was off. The guy unbolt all the bolts.

What you need more ?

the reason ? I dont know, loose bolt? non loose bolt and bushing was squeezed ?

The car was hit hard in pot hole.

you know at the rear you have 1 bolt at the control harm to adjust the car right? If my 2 rear wheels are not squared with the font , impossible to get the car straight.

not a rare issue on audi and bmw. get your car on a curb, and the sub frame is shifted. People who dont know shit about those car, wont be able to align it the right way. And it was my case, loosing 3 days and money until a shop where the owner owned about 40 bmw explained it to me. Sorry if the word I used are not bmw tech wise.

not surprised to see people making fun of it, glad for you , you don't live in a country who got 3rd world country road, and most of you get the car straight with the classic : Front & rear camber; front & rear toe ;thrust angle



https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1506694

Your post makes zero sense.

[oVeRdOsE.]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

Your post makes zero sense.

its objective, what the fck people dont understand.

1- Rear subframe is rotated of xx°.
2- If you dont know it and start the aligment , all 4 wheels are impossible to align.
3- Get the subframe squared with the chassis or the front first.
4- get alignment done.


I'll get my sheet, receipe, and I call the tech for you.

Again, I'm feeling my explanation, or world I'm using are not right, but it makes sense since the car was not going in straight line, even after a general alignment garage, and now it does after a 2h job @ bmw tech.

[freakystyly]

I think he's refering to "crab walking", it may line up on paper but your car is going sideways. It's more common in commercial vans or trucks that have seen some things.

[oVeRdOsE.]

Originally Posted by freakystyly

I think he's refering to "crab walking", it may line up on paper but your car is going sideways. It's more common in commercial vans or trucks that have seen some things.

this is what I had indeed.

this was great enough to the first garage tell me my frame was bent.

[lowrydr310]

Originally Posted by ryan stewart

I guess. But no car I've had in the past 23 year has even been in the parking lot of a "lube n tune" like place. Too many legit independents for the things you can't do at home.

I've tried the quick lube places a few times, all when I was much younger (and didn't have a BMW). The first time, I figured if Jiffy Lube can do the change for $20 and 15 minutes, it saved me from getting dirty. All went well until I saw the 'mechanic' finish the oil change and then spend another 20 minutes going over my car looking at other things. When I saw the guy unbolting my airbox that's when I ran over and told him to stop, that I just wanted an oil change and wanted to get the hell out of there.

When it was time to pay, they told me my air filter was dirty and 'had to' be replaced, and my transmission needed a flush. I had just changed the air filter and replaced the transmisssion fluid a few months prior. No thanks, never again. I know it's their business to upsell, but I felt deceived that they were pushing unnecessary work. Who knows how many unsuspecting consumers they do that to.

That was Jiffy Lube, and they're not even *that* bad. Firestone is a whole different beast from what I've read. There's no way I'd ever go there.

I did used to work next to a gas station with a few service bays owned/operated by an old man which had been there for years. I never chatted too much, but I'm guessing it was a family business going several generations. I had my oil changes done there for a while. I'd bring my own oil and filter and he'd charge me $8 labor.

[Tambohamilton]

$8!?!? Man, he must have been bored/desperate. Awesome deal for you, but certainly not worth him getting his hands dirty. I hope he's still going

[CTinline-six]

Originally Posted by oVeRdOsE.

its objective, what the fck people dont understand.

1- Rear subframe is rotated of xx°.
2- If you dont know it and start the aligment , all 4 wheels are impossible to align.
3- Get the subframe squared with the chassis or the front first.
4- get alignment done.


I'll get my sheet, receipe, and I call the tech for you.

Again, I'm feeling my explanation, or world I'm using are not right, but it makes sense since the car was not going in straight line, even after a general alignment garage, and now it does after a 2h job @ bmw tech.

Nope, I meant more that it was difficult to read due to the lack of complete sentences.

[tlow98]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Yup. I let my sport-package E90 go 182,000 miles without an alignment and was getting between 35K -40K out of a set of High performance all-seasons. At 182K I replaced the struts and shocks with new all BMW OE sport suspension components. I had a fancy boutique foreign car shop do the alignment and they fucked it royal. Had the same issue Porsche959 has; it ate the tires in about 4K miles. Took the car to another well respected tire shop to get new tires and an alignment. Was convincingly told they had a tech who specialized in BMW alignments. He got it a bit better and got tire life to about 20K.

I finally took it to my local BMW dealership. Got it spot on and back to 35K tire life. Most shops have no idea how to work on BMWs.

Good to know. I'll happily pay the dealer in this case.

[MightyMouseTech]

Originally Posted by oVeRdOsE.

its objective, what the fck people dont understand.

1- Rear subframe is rotated of xx°.
2- If you dont know it and start the aligment , all 4 wheels are impossible to align.
3- Get the subframe squared with the chassis or the front first.
4- get alignment done.


I'll get my sheet, receipe, and I call the tech for you.

Again, I'm feeling my explanation, or world I'm using are not right, but it makes sense since the car was not going in straight line, even after a general alignment garage, and now it does after a 2h job @ bmw tech.

Both the front and rear subframes are located with TWO pins. It is not moving anywhere. I do 1000 alignments a year on these cars exclusively.

[Tambohamilton]

Originally Posted by MightyMouseTech

Both the front and rear subframes are located with TWO pins. It is not moving anywhere. I do 1000 alignments a year on these cars exclusively.

I agree with what you're saying. Though when I did the rear subframe bushings, I noticed that there's a good couple of mm of slack between the bushings and alignment pins, though probably not as much as 1/8"... Do you ever try to centralise the subframe within that region of slack, or would you just bolt it up and call it done?

Also what's your take on loading/ride height while setting geo? Is that something you do on every car?

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Yup. I let my sport-package E90 go 182,000 miles without an alignment and was getting between 35K -40K out of a set of High performance all-seasons. At 182K I replaced the struts and shocks with new all BMW OE sport suspension components. I had a fancy boutique foreign car shop do the alignment and they fucked it royal. Had the same issue Porsche959 has; it ate the tires in about 4K miles. Took the car to another well respected tire shop to get new tires and an alignment. Was convincingly told they had a tech who specialized in BMW alignments. He got it a bit better and got tire life to about 20K.

I finally took it to my local BMW dealership. Got it spot on and back to 35K tire life. Most shops have no idea how to work on BMWs.

Dealership alignments 4 life.

I’m happy to pay the cost for a job done right. Not only that, but if things do get fcked you actually have some recourse. (When I worked at a dealership I witnessed firsthand the lengths they went to in order to appease pissed off customers.)

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

Nope, I meant more that it was difficult to read due to the lack of complete sentences.

Lol. I think French is his native language. Location: MTL is almost certainly Montreal; third-world roads is most certainly Montreal. ;-)

[slowcar]

Originally Posted by e90yyc

Dealership alignments 4 life.

I’m happy to pay the cost for a job done right. Not only that, but if things do get fcked you actually have some recourse. (When I worked at a dealership I witnessed firsthand the lengths they went to in order to appease pissed off customers.)

how much does that run you?

not worth it to a constant modder. I would have paid $1,000s in alignments.

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by slowcar

how much does that run you?

not worth it to a constant modder. I would have paid $1,000s in alignments.

Not much, but I only get alignments when absolutely necessary. I can certainly understand in your case where it might not make sense. For me I’m running average tires with a stock-everything 328. If I was a heavy modder I might be singing a different tune.

[MightyMouseTech]

Originally Posted by Tambohamilton

I agree with what you're saying. Though when I did the rear subframe bushings, I noticed that there's a good couple of mm of slack between the bushings and alignment pins, though probably not as much as 1/8"... Do you ever try to centralise the subframe within that region of slack, or would you just bolt it up and call it done?

Also what's your take on loading/ride height while setting geo? Is that something you do on every car?

We use ride height sensors at all four corners. The alignment machine compensates for the difference in ride height in the target specifications. That means no loading required. It will usually call for different specs at all four wheels because of that. Even a difference of 1 mm in ride height will change the camber spec.

As for the subframes, it is bolt it up and send it to the rack. If you loosen off the subframe bolts and try shifting the subframe, nothing happens. So there is no point.

[Tambohamilton]

Super interesting, thanks.

Well, my rear subframe can be shuttled slightly with the bolts loosened. Lemforder M3 bushings on an e91 though, if that makes a difference...?