[**Jay-V**]

[QUOTE=S4to335;779314] I have been on track days when you could stay out as long as you wanted....open track. QUOTE]

That would be crazy fun, but I would be tired as hell

[**Jay-V**]

Originally Posted by S4to335

I would get motul RBF600 over ATE super blue any day.

Reason I use the ATE is becuase it comes in blue and gold so when you have to change the fluids, it's much easier due to the color difference

Motul RBF600 is good stuff too

[urnuts]

If you've never driven on a track, it will amaze you what a crappy car you have- with a few exceptions- an Elise perhaps, maybe a Boxster or the like.
I've done some track driving (not real racing) in my M3 (1998), VW GTI 16v (1987) and my 300ZX Twin Turbo; Watkins Glen, NHIS, Lime Rock.
Without getting into details- the one thing that never ceased to amaze me is how quickly you come to realize how really poor your car's braking, handling, etc is on a track.... after thinking it was great.
Think you've got "great brakes"- slotted this, carbon that, cross-drilled here, s/s lines, etc.... yeah, they'll be on FIRE in 5 hot laps. Naturally, there are exceptions, but if you haven't dropped big bucks or real track-ready brakes, you're just a poser.
Handling, same thing. You can play Andretti in the canyons all day long- wait until you hit Big Bend at Lime Rock... and you are in the weeds.
I tell people (not that I know much, btw) how rough and humiliating 5 hot laps are on a track- people pull into the pits realizing the incredible limitations of their cars; thinking they were driving super high-performance cars. Maybe they were- but ONLY for the street.
The men and boys are quickly separated!
M3 was pretty good- 300Z was a fat cow and acted like the fat 4500lb pig she was- brakes MELTED! GTI was pretty good, too. Lots of fun, but slow in the straights.

[**Jay-V**]

As long as you're out there to have fun, drive within your limits and your vehicle's limits, and not wanting to be the next Michael Schumacer, you'll be fine

Those wanabe Michael Schumacers learn the hardway very quickly

[**Jay-V**]

Originally Posted by S4to335

Try tracking at 105 degrees at Buttonwillow/Willow Springs/Thunderhill sometime..its a little bit different at that temp.

It was about 85 degrees at Spring Mountain Raceway (Pahrump NV) when we went and that was no day at the beach I've just heard how horrible it is to be out at SOW or the big track on a 100 + degree day :mad:

[Ghunger]

Hmm, this seems very pessimistic. I've been to a few track days and I didn't get that feeling at all. I had tons of fun and really was impressed with the car. Mine's a 330 but I'm sure any of the E9X would be similar. A 335 should be a blast at the track. Sure, it's not race prepped porsche but these are HPDE's and driving schools, we're not racing in the DTM or something.

Originally Posted by urnuts

If you've never driven on a track, it will amaze you what a crappy car you have- with a few exceptions- an Elise perhaps, maybe a Boxster or the like.
I've done some track driving (not real racing) in my M3 (1998), VW GTI 16v (1987) and my 300ZX Twin Turbo; Watkins Glen, NHIS, Lime Rock.
Without getting into details- the one thing that never ceased to amaze me is how quickly you come to realize how really poor your car's braking, handling, etc is on a track.... after thinking it was great.
Think you've got "great brakes"- slotted this, carbon that, cross-drilled here, s/s lines, etc.... yeah, they'll be on FIRE in 5 hot laps. Naturally, there are exceptions, but if you haven't dropped big bucks or real track-ready brakes, you're just a poser.
Handling, same thing. You can play Andretti in the canyons all day long- wait until you hit Big Bend at Lime Rock... and you are in the weeds.
I tell people (not that I know much, btw) how rough and humiliating 5 hot laps are on a track- people pull into the pits realizing the incredible limitations of their cars; thinking they were driving super high-performance cars. Maybe they were- but ONLY for the street.
The men and boys are quickly separated!
M3 was pretty good- 300Z was a fat cow and acted like the fat 4500lb pig she was- brakes MELTED! GTI was pretty good, too. Lots of fun, but slow in the straights.

[Craigito]

Originally Posted by S4to335

Are you guys talkin about Streets of Willow..or Willow..the big track. They are totally different tracks.

For $120 for the day, I'm assuming it's the "streets" since that is what I remember the cost was when I did it. That's why I don't think he'll have issues. Much slower track.

[cycler2]

Originally Posted by picus

This is interesting. You didn't happen to check to see if they have the external oil cooler?

I did not check. I'm pretty sure the cars were factory stock, though, so unless the external cooler now comes standard, the 335's we drove likely did not have it. BTW, we were told that the cars used during driving schools are later sold. I wonder how they are described in ads. "Driven only on Sundays....

You could contact the Performance Center technical center and ask. A nice fellow named Richard runs the tech center and he is very generous with sharing information.

[Park2670]

Originally Posted by S4to335

A friend of mine let me take out his Lotus Exige on the track at Miller Motorsports in Utah...

I am going out there this month in my E90. I am so excited. What did you think of our new track?

[ATL_Architect]

Originally Posted by cycler2

I did not check. I'm pretty sure the cars were factory stock, though, so unless the external cooler now comes standard, the 335's we drove likely did not have it. BTW, we were told that the cars used during driving schools are later sold. I wonder how they are described in ads. "Driven only on Sundays....

You could contact the Performance Center technical center and ask. A nice fellow named Richard runs the tech center and he is very generous with sharing information.

When I was at the Performance Center in August I asked about what they do with the cars as well. I was told they are reconditioned and sold at auction with a notice about what they have been used for. In addition, they said there is note in the vehicle maintance history, so that if anyone runs a maintance history by VIN it will tell them as well. Oh, and they said those cars aren't eligible for CPO

Also, when I was there they stressed that all the cars at the Performance Center are stock with no modifications. I would be surprised if they added an oil cooler to the 335's.

[CrazyHohol]

Originally Posted by picus

I'm interested in the comments about brake fade. I've seen a lot of people claim the 335i's brakes won't fade. I did notice some fade. It was not nearly as pronounced as my last car, but it was there.

I missed LSD a lot less than I thought I would, for what it's worth. If I were tracking seriously I'd add a good bbk before LSD, although I'd probably do both eventually.

They will definetley fade i did some hard driving around some deserte roads they were fading after a good 30 minutes sometimes worryingly.

[bartman32]

+! "I don't mean this to sound like a jerk, but unless you have a lot of experience at track days, you aren't going to be pushing the car anywhere near it's capabilities. And that's a good thing; it leave reserve for mistakes. Track days are awesome - have a great time and post pictures and video"

Track days are AWESOME and teach you a TON about your car and car control. I tracked my e46 stock for a very long time. Only thing I ever did was slotted rooters for cooling. Just take it slow and easy and don't go beyond your limits. Don't push it and you'll find that you are going very fast and in control fairly quickly. It's a TON of fun and done right it doesn't have to be too dangerous to your car and you shouldn't have to think you need to do much to it. BMW makes a great car and it can take a lot.

Now if you want to be in a racing club and be serious that's an entirely different story! But just starting out, try what you got...

Oh, and be prepared to replace tires and brakes a bit more often.

[BoostedBMW]

Originally Posted by teknochild

335 is not a very good track car, it will get hot very fast, the brakes will fade and the lack of LSD meens it shouldnt be on the track in the first place

if you absolutly have to your going to go slow or your going to burn through tires pretty fast


but if your asking should you really be going to a track?

So I guess everyone is born with track experience? You need to start somewhere. If he would have posted about driving aggressive on the street, you would have told him to bring it to the track.

[S4to335]

Originally Posted by BoostedBMW

So I guess everyone is born with track experience? You need to start somewhere. If he would have posted about driving aggressive on the street, you would have told him to bring it to the track.

Chicken? Egg? what is first.

All this track talk makes me want to hit the track again.

[BMW F22]

Originally Posted by S4to335

Chicken? Egg? what is first.

All this track talk makes me want to hit the track again.

hey S4- u willing to give me some tips on how to "drive"???

[S4to335]

Originally Posted by BMWE90

hey S4- u willing to give me some tips on how to "drive"???

Sure, what do you want to know?.

Most important things to think about while on track:

1) Breathe
2) Relax
3) Work on the line..speed will come later
4) Use all the track...(meaning track out ..dont go down the middle of the track..and hit your apexes)
5) Wear comfortable clothing
6) Both hands on the wheel at all times
7) Never put your hand out the window, except for when you are exiting the track or if you are disabled while still on the track or trying to leave the track
8) Drink plenty of water
9) If someone catches you in the corners he is faster than you..even if you could blow by him in the straights. LET HIM PASS.
10) Watch your mirrors when you are approaching a straightaway...and let the faster car pass.
11) Do not be overly concerned with someone behind you..concentrate on where YOU are going..not what the guy behind you is doing.
12) If you do spin out...STAY IN YOUR CAR..and wait for the nice flag people to wave you back on the track.
13) This is not a race..this is a school...to teach you car control skills..there are no Formula One scouts out there...so take it easy. You want to come home with your car in one piece..with just a bit more tire wear..and brake pad wear. You do not want the wifey to yell at you for the next ten years..because you came back home in a cab and told her that you just totalled your daily driver...NOT.
14) Most important one...VISION...watch way ahead of you...not just right in front of the car..be aware of what is going on 1, 2, 3 turns ahead.

There are lots more tidbits..but these are a few to work on for now.

I wrote this about 7-8 years ago...

http://www.audiworld.com/tech/misc9.shtml

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by SROC3

You see, I'm planning to go to Willow in May for a track-day event (a drive around for $120/day) and was wondering......will my brakes fade? Are my tires too crummy for the track? Will my clutch get affected (assuming I drive fine and do not subject the car to tons of driveline shock by shifting like a noob)?

I was thinking that I should get some ceramic brake pads. Is this even necessary? I mean I know the M3 would be most likely ok, but I have doubts about the cars "trackability" without upgrades.

Kindly lend your thoughts o great forumers........

Don't spend money on major upgrades until you see what it does on a track. The only things that I would do are for safety.....

• Get some good brake pads
• Get some racing brake fluid and do a full system flush

Your car will be fine.

[bartman32]

S4to335 knows what he's talking about. Take it calm and easy and you'll have a TON of fun! Listen to the instructors and don't push it. Before you know it you'll be going faster without even trying. Plus you learn a TON about your car and car control.
I would DEFINATELY recomend a driving school to everyone!

[BMW F22]

Originally Posted by S4to335

Sure, what do you want to know?.

Most important things to think about while on track:

1) Breathe
2) Relax
3) Work on the line..speed will come later
4) Use all the track...(meaning track out ..dont go down the middle of the track..and hit your apexes)
5) Wear comfortable clothing
6) Both hands on the wheel at all times
7) Never put your hand out the window, except for when you are exiting the track or if you are disabled while still on the track or trying to leave the track
8) Drink plenty of water
9) If someone catches you in the corners he is faster than you..even if you could blow by him in the straights. LET HIM PASS.
10) Watch your mirrors when you are approaching a straightaway...and let the faster car pass.
11) Do not be overly concerned with someone behind you..concentrate on where YOU are going..not what the guy behind you is doing.
12) If you do spin out...STAY IN YOUR CAR..and wait for the nice flag people to wave you back on the track.
13) This is not a race..this is a school...to teach you car control skills..there are no Formula One scouts out there...so take it easy. You want to come home with your car in one piece..with just a bit more tire wear..and brake pad wear. You do not want the wifey to yell at you for the next ten years..because you came back home in a cab and told her that you just totalled your daily driver...NOT.
14) Most important one...VISION...watch way ahead of you...not just right in front of the car..be aware of what is going on 1, 2, 3 turns ahead.

There are lots more tidbits..but these are a few to work on for now.

I wrote this about 7-8 years ago...

http://www.audiworld.com/tech/misc9.shtml

Excellent, thanks for the site too.

[S4to335]

Originally Posted by Park2670

I am going out there this month in my E90. I am so excited. What did you think of our new track?

Here is what I thought... Yes, I am the contributing editor for this article

http://www.audiworld.com/news/06/mil.../content.shtml

[Adham]

Originally Posted by choatie88

Realistically, how often do people roll their cars at these events? I can't see how you'd do that unless you were driving WELL beyond your ability.

It happens more often than you think. Ive rolled one, and i was driving well within my capabilities.

[Park2670]

Thanks for the tips. I am very excited about my track experience soon!