[Hellkite]

Is there anyone running around, day to day with a successfully fully built N54 engine, with rods, pistons the whole bit. Im looking find out what engine builder to use?

[boostE92d]

The only ones I'm sure of are vendors. Burger tuning and VTT. I'm pretty sure the Vargas one is doing well. Burger tuning has their own forum and don't come here, so you will have to go there to ask questions. Chris@VargasTurboTech is here though. I'm pretty sure they have a motor built by ABR here in Houston.

[boostE92d]

MMP does it as well. I haven't heard of anyone running one of their motors yet.

[Hellkite]

I herd Chris had problems with his motor from abr I'm not sure if it's true. I know motive does the N54 engine but I haven't really herd of any real success in rebuilding the n54.

[boostE92d]

Well that sucks to hear. It sounds like the n54 is pretty hard to rebuild correctly. The last I heard the burger tuning motor had "false knock." What ever that means.

[Hellkite]

The false knock comes from to much piston slap. These engine builders try to make the engine loose for more power but the BMW electronics are to sensitive.

[mxchris727]

These engines are very easy to rebuild. The only special consideration is the sealant used to bond the bed plate and crank seals to the block.

[Hellkite]

Have you rebuilt them? Or know someone who has with success? Because I'm hearing the opposite. And are we talking about stock or upgraded engine. I ask because if we look at vvt and burger having issues and these guys are the leaders in the N54 field. I want to make sure we are comparing apples to apples.

[Jklad]

Originally Posted by Hellkite

Have you rebuilt them? Or know someone who has with success? Because I'm hearing the opposite. And are we talking about stock or upgraded engine. I ask because if we look at vvt and burger having issues and these guys are the leaders in the N54 field. I want to make sure we are comparing apples to apples.

I wouldn't exactly call either of them them "leaders in the n54 engine building field", or engine building in general. They provide some good/decent/sometimes poopy peripheral products though. We don't exactly have engine builders for the n54 the way m3/m4, corvettes, mustangs, and Camaros have engine builders.

[Hellkite]

You are right they aren't engine builders but they are N54 top supporters with resources and I'm sure they didn't get there motors built by unskilled engine builders but the top BMW engine builders in the country. The whole reason I put this thread up was to find someone to rebuild my motor with upgraded parts. I'm looking for a solution myself, but everywhere I turn I get a big price tag and a (fact supported) story from somewhere else saying it didn't work out.

Originally Posted by Hellkite

I'm looking for a solution myself, but everywhere I turn I get a big price tag and a (fact supported) story from somewhere else saying it didn't work out.

Given so few options, the "big price tag" part is unavoidable.

What "fact supported" stories are you hearing? Would be interested in seeing this info first hand...

Also, you never mentioned what your power goals were. More than likely, a junkyard motor or 2 or 3 will likely do you (and your wallet) just fine.

[limitdown]

Rebuilding to stock is very easy. My engine was rebuilt 2 yrs ago by a non-specialist shop. The same shop also services/repairs my wife's Toyota minivan.
I've been pushing 18 to 21psi everyday since then.
You just need the N54-specific timing tool.

I didn't get any machining or boring.
The new closed deck inserts would give more support to avoid ovaling at high whp. Ovaling might cause piston slap. Or perhaps, some combinations of aftermarket pistons and rods change harmonics just enough to trigger the sensitive knock sensor.
I'm not sure if VTT's "Punisher" motor built by ABR had inserts.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1098808

Originally Posted by limitdown

Rebuilding to stock is very easy. My engine was rebuilt 2 yrs ago by a non-specialist shop.

What exactly did that "rebuilding" consist of?

[limitdown]

Originally Posted by FCobra94

What exactly did that "rebuilding" consist of?

One set of rings crapped out on me, so they essentially needed to tear everything down.
I proactively replaced all bearings and gaskets, including the head gasket. I didn't get boring or machining, so I used the original-thickness head gasket.
A few small things in the head were replaced, like the collets, but I remember reusing the old tappets, rocker arms, valves.

[Hellkite]

I recently found out some new info, most of the engine builds being done by the high end rebuilders in states are using either JE or CP pistons and the problem with these pistons is that they are made with 2618 aluminum witch has low silicon count with low silicon count there is a lot of thermal expansion so the clearance needs to be bigger which could result more piston slap. More piston slap = more possible false knock. What I am reading these motors would be better off using 4032 aluminum pistons which have a much higher silicon count so less thermal expansion and tighter clearances can be used. On another subject with the bottom end when you clamp the the crank down with higher end hardware it might misshape the main caps/girdle a little so a real good line bore job must be done. So I can see why rebuilding stock would be much less problematic.

[Bigugly]

Originally Posted by Hellkite

The false knock comes from to much piston slap. These engine builders try to make the engine loose for more power but the BMW electronics are to sensitive.

That's not the case. Piston to wall clearance for a forged piston has to be correct, or you WILL get piston slap (as any forged engine will get when cold) but the closed deck and forged pistons sometimes will cause false knock.

Originally Posted by limitdown

Rebuilding to stock is very easy. My engine was rebuilt 2 yrs ago by a non-specialist shop. The same shop also services/repairs my wife's Toyota minivan.
I've been pushing 18 to 21psi everyday since then.
You just need the N54-specific timing tool.

I didn't get any machining or boring.
The new closed deck inserts would give more support to avoid ovaling at high whp. Ovaling might cause piston slap. Or perhaps, some combinations of aftermarket pistons and rods change harmonics just enough to trigger the sensitive knock sensor.
I'm not sure if VTT's "Punisher" motor built by ABR had inserts.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1098808

No inserts, but closed deck. It's not just as simple as "use a timing tool". I promise lol

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

We had problems with the ABR motor, and went elsewhere. ABR is a top notch shop, and we respect them greatly (Alex knows his stuff), we just went another direction.

There is a learning curve with a built motor. Generally ours runs like a clock until we money shifted it (ouch) and then spun the crank hub. Tony is not easy on these motors; hundreds and hundreds of dyno pulls and testing.

Chris

[JuniorB]

Hi,I was in the same boat when I bought a 07 n54 for my swap that I plan on doing, found out a lot of interesting topics with this motor, called very limited! Although they make oversize crank bearings,they make no conn bearings,the leading cause of damage from what I can gather. So that means a few options,ecs has a reman crank and bearings,@$1.5 last time I checked ,with crank bearings,but your still limited to stock conn bearings. Most can do a 3angle valve job on the head,very basic,the block gets tricky,some never heard of a n motor,some say you need a tourque plate,that no one has,some say it's fine because it will move being a turbo motor,it will run loose anyway, I saw what ARB was doing with a spun crank,that ends up going to a motor because of what he does to the crank. The forged piston theory is that you can development a false knock,just a theory as some run it,all in all a reman can shoot up to $10k if your not on your toes,I see these high dollar rebuilds are unnecessary if running stock turbos,sorry for going on,just things I have found along the way,so I just bought a used low mileage motor complete.

[Quick335XI]

Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech

We had problems with the ABR motor, and went elsewhere. ABR is a top notch shop, and we respect them greatly (Alex knows his stuff), we just went another direction.

Yeah, ABR is crap and the people are really rude. I'm in the market to build up a motor and wrote them because there web site was down and some guy named alex was a real DICK for no reason.

I'm looking into Motiv and MMP, will keep everyone posted

[Bigugly]

Terry, I wish you the best of luck in the future.

[Jeef]

Interesting...I just talked with ABR as well and they were very nice and helping.

Something must have happened? Lol

[m5james]

Tire kicker or asks a lot of questions (which is more my style) vs those who open their wallets with no questions asked could be the difference here.