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      03-10-2019, 09:48 AM   #1
JohnDaviz
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Rebuild engine after 600 miles - Oil smells again like fuel

Re-Post (Not sure if the other sub-forum was right)

Hi all,

recently i had the pleasure to rebuild my engine due to a spun rod bearing on cyl 3.

It was literally so worn out that one bearing half was as thin and bendable like aluminum foil. The Rod has some fancy coloring now too.
After the failure we opened the oil cap and the oil smell was as there was fuel in it.

With the new engine it is the same. Just after 30 miles the oil smelled like fuel. After 600 Miles now it literally still smells like fuel again. Even after driving for 100 miles and hot oil. Coming to a stop - it does not smell like oil.

I compared to a C43 2019 model (only comparison i could do in short term) with 2400 miles on it and the oil smells like oil.

I now started to watch AFR through MHD and there is something strange going on.

Bank 1 AFR drops to low 13ish values when coming to a stop at a traffic light and it needs a fews seconds to come back to the same level as bank 2. Always with every stop.

Also when getting off the throttle bank 2 afr seems to go immediately to 234 but bank 1 not. Feels like its taking forever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hs3e0o4xeJQ


I had to accelerate again but you can see the value dropping shortly to 13 something.

I have my doubts that this is normal?!

My next steps are to control the spark plugs and if one or more seems to be running rich.

Oil changed after 600 miles and new filter. So far no metallic parts. I am really paranoid because of the smell.


I also have a log of what i mean:

https://datazap.me/u/johndaviz/afr-r...ata=3-15-16-22
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      03-10-2019, 10:49 AM   #2
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are the injectors brand new/no issues?
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      03-10-2019, 11:05 AM   #3
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Injectors are less than five months old. All Index 12
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      03-10-2019, 11:15 AM   #4
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The oil temp is at 90, wait till your car is fully warmed at 160 before logging. Also double check all your electrical connections, and make sure your 02 sensors are not backwards.

Do you know what caused the first engine to fail from the spin rod? The cause, like to much power ect... Are the 02 sensors new? Were your injectors bought new?
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      03-10-2019, 11:59 AM   #5
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Injector issue. Taking a while to get to 234 on decel is classic injector leaking symptoms.
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      03-10-2019, 11:33 PM   #6
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So how old are front o2s? If both dont go full lambda within 3 sec or say 5 log events of lift throttle you should change them. And if you have them switched it will code so I dont think thats it.


Then go injs (or move one from the back bank to the front).. Im on board with chris that.

No cold start issues?
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      03-11-2019, 12:53 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buster84 View Post
The oil temp is at 90, wait till your car is fully warmed at 160 before logging. Also double check all your electrical connections, and make sure your 02 sensors are not backwards.

Do you know what caused the first engine to fail from the spin rod? The cause, like to much power ect... Are the 02 sensors new? Were your injectors bought new?
This is not Fahrenheit It is 90 Degrees Celsius.
I tend to think the o2 sensors are fine, but i am watching them.

I don´t know why the bearing went to hell
But may be the issue is still in my car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech View Post
Injector issue. Taking a while to get to 234 on decel is classic injector leaking symptoms.
This is exactly what i am thinking! But i dont have ANY issues at all except as what we see in the log.

I have the feeling that one injector is damaged and spraying rich. But when the car is not running, the injector is not leaking.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 335e92tx View Post

Then go injs (or move one from the back bank to the front).. Im on board with chris that.

No cold start issues?

I will! I ordered the injector seals and one injector to replace the suspected injecotr.

No cold start issues. No idle issues. Basically no issues at all. Except the crazy fuel smell.

I will check spark plugs today. Hopefully one is indicating a rich running cylinder. That would ease my work.
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      03-11-2019, 08:31 AM   #8
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I second Chris.

Pull the plugs and see if any look black...
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      03-11-2019, 10:28 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbnks2 View Post
I second Chris.

Pull the plugs and see if any look black...
This...looks like bank 1 is where your problem lies.
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      03-11-2019, 10:31 AM   #10
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Lol crazy fuel smell .... coming out the exhaust?
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      03-11-2019, 11:00 AM   #11
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If you're seeing that issue in your logs, and you're smelling fuel, and think it's diluting your oil, run, do not walk, to change out those injectors, unless you like the idea of spinning bearings. If it's showing in a log that it's leaking, then it leaks, period. Change it out!


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      03-12-2019, 06:25 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbnks2 View Post
Pull the plugs and see if any look black...
Yeah i have planned that already for saturday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FCobra94 View Post
This...looks like bank 1 is where your problem lies.
Yeah that is what i figured also from the Log.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech View Post
If you're seeing that issue in your logs, and you're smelling fuel, and think it's diluting your oil, run, do not walk, to change out those injectors, unless you like the idea of spinning bearings. If it's showing in a log that it's leaking, then it leaks, period. Change it out!


Chris
I am pretty sure that the previous engine failure was due to that leaking injector. Luckily i have another nice daily.

I will replace injectors asap! Thanks

Last edited by JohnDaviz; 03-12-2019 at 06:28 AM.. Reason: quotes
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      03-15-2019, 11:27 AM   #13
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Interim Update:
Took the car to our own little private shop and pulled the plugs. All look the same and have aged "normal". No Sign of rich mixture.

I also pulled the first three injectors from Bank 1.
Just to be sure. Bank 1 is Cylinders 1,2 and three counting from the front of the car right?
They also look the same. But i guess it is hard to see anything on them when they are not obviously broken in half.

So tomorrows plan:
New plugs
Swap injectors bank1 and bank2 and see if error goes with the swap.


One weird thing
Injector on cyl 2 (second from the front) was very loose. I was able to pull it without applying nearly as much force as on the others. I.e. i pulled it by hand with no tool as needed for the others.

What are the consequences if the sealing does not seal properly?

Last edited by JohnDaviz; 03-15-2019 at 11:39 AM..
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      03-15-2019, 01:08 PM   #14
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I'm curious if it ends up being an injector, did the car never spit any codes?
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      03-15-2019, 02:17 PM   #15
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Yes Bank 1 is Cyl 1,2,3 (Cyl 1 is at the front of the car)

Don't forget to recode the injectors when you swap them.

Very Interested in hearing what you find out.

I'm currently dealing with an issue where my
-oil also smells of fuel
-misfires on Cyl 1,2,3
-loss of power
-very strong vibrations under >5% throttle
-very rough idle & stalling (misfires)
-black soot out the exhaust

I pulled plugs, all were dirty, #2 was wet & smelled of fuel.
^Sounds like classic bad injector(s) right? (running original Index 9's)
Took to dealership for warranty replacement, they swapped out O2 Bank 1, Sensor 2 (at outrageous labor costs) and it's running normal now (1 day & 50 miles later).
I'm just waiting for those codes to show back up... I want those injectors replaced for free.

'12 E92 335is @ 48k
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      03-15-2019, 02:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John.N View Post
Yes Bank 1 is Cyl 1,2,3 (Cyl 1 is at the front of the car)

Don't forget to recode the injectors when you swap them.

Very Interested in hearing what you find out.

I'm currently dealing with an issue where my
-oil also smells of fuel
-misfires on Cyl 1,2,3
-loss of power
-very strong vibrations under >5% throttle
-very rough idle & stalling (misfires)
-black soot out the exhaust

I pulled plugs, all were dirty, #2 was wet & smelled of fuel.
^Sounds like classic bad injector(s) right? (running original Index 9's)
Took to dealership for warranty replacement, they swapped out O2 Bank 1, Sensor 2 (at outrageous labor costs) and it's running normal now (1 day & 50 miles later).
I'm just waiting for those codes to show back up... I want those injectors replaced for free.

'12 E92 335is @ 48k
thank you for your input.

I have a little hope now that the O2 sensor is bad on bank 1.
I will of course do the re-coding
I will report tomorrow what i did.

Tell me. Is the smell gone?


Still curious what a bad O2 Sensor may do.

I am not having any Codes @ jokers_greg

Last edited by JohnDaviz; 03-15-2019 at 02:55 PM..
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      03-15-2019, 07:01 PM   #17
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Happy to provide any information I can... everybody is trying to figure something out.

I forgot to mention I was throwing codes for:
Misfires in 1
Misfires in 2
Misfires in 3
Multiple Cylinder Misfires
AND... I also had an O2 sensor fault code for Bank 1/Sensor 2:
P0138: O2 Sensor Circuit High Voltage (Bank 1 Sensor 2)
I forgot the BMW - Specific code #

But I believe it was just a result of running rich and excess fuel getting dumped & not burned - leading me to think bad/leaking injector. Also the code was 'Pending' (it went away, leaving only the misfire codes).
Because of the O2 fault code, the dealership wouldn't do anything before replacing the O2 Sensor (stupid logic in my opinion). So I'm thinking the car is a ticking time bomb now

It maybe worth noting that I just changed the oil & filter ~14 days / 300 miles ago (4 days/200 miles prior to the issues starting). --No I didn't F-Up the oil change, in case anybody was wondering.
I use Pennzoil Platinum Euro SAE Full Synthetic Motor Oil 5W-40. Prior to these issues occurring, I honestly can't say that I smelled the oil after running it through the engine.

+30 miles: Just checked the smell of the oil - still smells like there is fuel in there to me. Smell was a little more difficult to read as the car was hot when checked. Maybe I'm loosing my sense of smell...but compared to my '15 Toyota 4Runner (Mobil 1 5w-20 Full Syn) - let's just say they are NOT the same.

I aim to change the plugs this weekend (was hoping for a bad injector and then have the dealership cover it). When I pull them, I'll be able to get a better idea if any are still wet/smell of fuel.

I'll also look into the AFR measurements for each bank. Not sure if Torque + generic Bluetooth ODB2 reader can show that in real-time.
Expecting BimmerGeek's ProTool cable should arrive in 2-3 days and I'll be able to get a more accurate readings through that.

I'll report back any new findings/changes

Best of luck tomorrow
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      03-17-2019, 03:18 AM   #18
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Ok.

Yesterday i changed all plugs and all look very similar.

To find the potential leaking injector on bank 1:

- Pulled injectors 1 to 5
- Put 4 and 5 to 1 and 2
- Re-sealed Injector 3 and let it in its place
- Put 2 to 4
- Put 1 brand new in 5

So with that setup i had 1 injector left on bank one and one injector from bank 1 on bank 2.

If AFR would be weird again it potentially could only be one injector.
Test drive. AFR weirdness still on Bank 1
Back to shop and fit the left injector from Bank 1 and swapped them.

AFR weirdness more or less gone. Not 100%

Drove about 60 miles on the highway with some pulls after oil was up to over 100°C.

Fuel smell in oil nearly gone completely. Very different from before!

It is not gone completely though. You can see on one picture that AFR is working perfect and on the other picture it is way off again.

How can a 5 five month old Index 12 Injector go bad so fast?
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      03-17-2019, 08:39 AM   #19
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Took the car for a short round.

I reseted all Lambda adaptions.

https://datazap.me/u/johndaviz/chang...ata=3-15-16-22

You can see during idle that AFR1 is way richer than Bank 2.

Andy ideas?
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      03-17-2019, 11:20 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDaviz View Post
Took the car for a short round.

I reseted all Lambda adaptions.

https://datazap.me/u/johndaviz/chang...ata=3-15-16-22

You can see during idle that AFR1 is way richer than Bank 2.

Andy ideas?
Did you recode the injectors after moving them? Each cyl is coded to the specific injector numbers.
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      03-18-2019, 04:23 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buster84 View Post
Did you recode the injectors after moving them? Each cyl is coded to the specific injector numbers.
Yes, i recoded them of course after interchanging.

I ordered Both O2 sensors for Bank 1 new to eliminate the possibility of faulty sensors.

I am struggeling to accept two dead injectors (Index 12) after just more than five months.
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      03-18-2019, 06:59 AM   #22
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Stranger things have happened...swap in new O2s, reset adaptations, and try again.
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