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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > BMW Performance Springs Installed (Comparison with ZSP Springs)



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      03-12-2009, 08:52 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwahlert View Post

replacing just the front bar - will it help to reduce understeer?
On a technical standpoint, a stiffer front sway bar will add understeer.
A thicker rear will decrease understeer, but too stiff of a rear will lead to snap oversteer.
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      03-12-2009, 03:13 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. 5 View Post
The euro e90 M performance is the same exact thing as the BMW performance dampers.
I verified that when I received my dampers.
They were the same part numbers.

IMO, BMW wanted to bring the euro M performance suspension to the states so they brought it over and called it "Performance".
I disagree, the Performance suspension eis stiffer than the euro M suspension.
Part number of the shocks are different between euro M suspension ant Performance

Actually I think that the performance kit for 135i is exactly the same of the one for e90 except that the shocks have different part number because they are stiffer for the eavier e90

OK I will build the 135i kit on my E92 and tell you how it works.
Springs are yellow T2 front and T2 rear
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      03-12-2009, 04:46 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
I disagree, the Performance suspension eis stiffer than the euro M suspension.
Part number of the shocks are different between euro M suspension ant Performance

Actually I think that the performance kit for 135i is exactly the same of the one for e90 except that the shocks have different part number because they are stiffer for the eavier e90

OK I will build the 135i kit on my E92 and tell you how it works.
Springs are yellow T2 front and T2 rear
Why would you disagree with me when I've already verified this?
Are you suggesting that I don't know how to read part numbers on my dampers??
Please read carefully and do some research...

The "performance" dampers on my car were the same exact dampers that were on the euro M sport package--period. Recently the M sport package has changed the dampers to a different part number.
Would you like for me to take a picture for you to prove it?

The springs are a different story.
But, you are entitled to believe whatever you want.

Go to realoem.com and type in production date 11/2006 euro and you will get this for the front suspension:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...4&hg=31&fg=10:

Notice that you will see the front left and rear left part numbers that are on my dampers that I have already disclosed earlier in the thread.

Do the same thing but pick 09/2008 and you'll see that they don't use the perf damers anymore.

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...94&hg=31&fg=10
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      03-12-2009, 05:29 PM   #92
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Mr. 5 I don't whanted to contradict you.
I have to say you have a lot of experience with BMW and I am here to learn and try to experiment.

Actually I went to the dealer to have exactly the numbers if the shocks from the Perfomance KIT retrofit (100% sure I have a printout of ETK).

Kit for E90/E92 (33500444832) Left:31316788887 Right: 31316788888 Rear: 33526788890

Kit for 135i (33500444831) Left:31316788885 Right: 31316788886 Rear: 33526788887

Stabilisator is for both kits only fornt 26.5mm 31356773522

The part numbers you gave me are indeed from the M sport suspension and not for the Performance suspension
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      03-13-2009, 12:20 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
Mr. 5 I don't whanted to contradict you.
I have to say you have a lot of experience with BMW and I am here to learn and try to experiment.

Actually I went to the dealer to have exactly the numbers if the shocks from the Perfomance KIT retrofit (100% sure I have a printout of ETK).

Kit for E90/E92 (33500444832) Left:31316788887 Right: 31316788888 Rear: 33526788890

Kit for 135i (33500444831) Left:31316788885 Right: 31316788886 Rear: 33526788887

Stabilisator is for both kits only fornt 26.5mm 31356773522

The part numbers you gave me are indeed from the M sport suspension and not for the Performance suspension

OK, well BMW obviousely changed the numbers then.
You've done your homework, but the part nubers that I have are different then the part numbers that you have.

I'm thinking the following either:
A: BMW changed the part numbers to the dampers that will go on both with the e90 and e92. Remember that when the performance suspension first came out, it was only for the e90. They might have changed it to go better suit both. (If this is the case, I'm really glad I got the one specificaly for the e90)
B: BMW has different part numbers for euro performance compared to US (I kind of doubt this)

It would be nice for others who have ordered the performance suspension to chime in on the part numbers that are on the dampers.

Here's my summarization:

I got the performance package here and installed it with my ZSP springs:



And, to prove it to you, I just took a picture of the rear shock and the left front. I didn't take a pic of the right because hopefully you will believe me that the right will go with the left.

Here they are:
Attached Images
  
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      03-13-2009, 12:31 PM   #94
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It seems that the performance Kit you received contains the shocks that are used in europe for M sport suspension.

Performance suspension in europe should be stiffer than M sport (that comes series with E92 european version)

The performance kit in europe has olso the front stabilisator bar... I don't see it on your picture.
So maybe there are 2 different kits for EU and US???????

Really confusing all this.

Will post some pictures of my kit for 135i when I receive it.
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      03-13-2009, 12:37 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
It seems that the performance Kit you received contains the shocks that are used in europe for M sport suspension.

Performance suspension in europe should be stiffer than M sport (that comes series with E92 european version)

The performance kit in europe has olso the front stabilisator bar... I don't see it on your picture.
So maybe there are 2 different kits for EU and US???????

Really confusing all this.

Will post some pictures of my kit for 135i when I receive it.
I just sent a PM to Evan at Tischer to try to clear things up.
I was thinking the same thing when I found that the performance suspension was being offered in europe. I was thinking why would they be offering the same dampers that are being offered on the car anyway?

Here's the thing...the front bar was not offered in my kit when I bought it. Since then they changed the kit by adding the front bar. Maybe they changed the dampers as well.
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      03-13-2009, 01:51 PM   #96
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I just got word from Evan that the new kit does have different part numbers that I have.
All I have to say is that whatever I have, I'm very happy with the ride quality and the performance it gives.

There's nothing like having a car that performs so well on a track yet is so comfortable to drive on the street.
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      03-13-2009, 03:39 PM   #97
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something strange:

The shocks of performance kit hwe mow different parts number than M sport suspension, so I assume these are stiffer than M suspension.

The yellow T3 T4 springs are rated to match the stiffer shocks of the performance kit.

So now you have the hard yellow springs on softer M sport shocks....

Normally D black springs should be matched to these shocks
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      03-13-2009, 04:08 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
something strange:

The shocks of performance kit hwe mow different parts number than M sport suspension, so I assume these are stiffer than M suspension.

The yellow T3 T4 springs are rated to match the stiffer shocks of the performance kit.

So now you have the hard yellow springs on softer M sport shocks....

Normally D black springs should be matched to these shocks
Do you have the M sport suspension right now though?
When I went from the normal sport dampers to the euro M sport dampers, it was a big difference. Then I changed to the yellow springs.
It's hard for me to see that much of a difference between my dampers and the new dampers.

If the yellow springs weren't meant to go with these dampers then they did a great job by mistake.
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      03-14-2009, 07:28 AM   #99
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Yes I live in europe and got directly the car with the M sport suspension and with the shocs you have in your car. (at least the equivalent for e92)
So I have the front and rear stiffer sway bars...

I didn't know that this wasn't available in US...

If BMW sells performance suspension kit that should be more firm and sporty than the M sport suspension...

Will tell you the difference when I will upgrade from European M sport to BMW Performance

IF OTHER MEMBERS HAVE THE PERFORMANCE KIT PLEASE TELL US THE PART NUMBER OF THE SHOCKS AND THE LETTERS OF THE SPRINGS
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      03-14-2009, 11:00 AM   #100
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Now all this has me thinking which kit or part of a kit did I get? I have T4 front and rear, but have no idea about the shock numbers, I never thought to document that.
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      03-14-2009, 04:48 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
Yes I live in europe and got directly the car with the M sport suspension and with the shocs you have in your car. (at least the equivalent for e92)
So I have the front and rear stiffer sway bars...

I didn't know that this wasn't available in US...

If BMW sells performance suspension kit that should be more firm and sporty than the M sport suspension...

Will tell you the difference when I will upgrade from European M sport to BMW Performance

IF OTHER MEMBERS HAVE THE PERFORMANCE KIT PLEASE TELL US THE PART NUMBER OF THE SHOCKS AND THE LETTERS OF THE SPRINGS
Actually, your front bar is only different than the rest of the cars because you have an e93. I asked Tischer about the part number of the sway bar that comes with the new performance kit and it was the same exact part number that comes on the e93 cars. BMW put a slightly different sway on your car for the increased stability of the convertible.

Your rear bar is 14mm and that is different than the states. Our sport package comes with the 13mm bar but I upgraded to the 14mm bar when I installed the performance dampers.

I'm sure you'll be able to notice a difference with the springs but I'm curious about the dampers. I've also been wondering about what you said about installing the 135 dampers on your 335. Don't you think that you'll get better performance out of the 335 dampers? The 135 is lighter and if the dampers are suited for that car then the 335 might feel a little slushy.
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      03-15-2009, 09:55 AM   #102
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Mr 5 i totally agree with you.

My situation is a little bit complicated:

1) There is no E93 BMW performance suspension kit, so I have to use the E90/92 Kit

2) There are no yellow performance rear springs to match the performance
shocks, E93 is heavier than E92 on the rear caused by the roof.

3) E93 with M sport suspension has 15mm rear bar and 26.5mm 31356772353 front bar. the front bar is always 26.5mm but more or less stiffer depending in the part number

I got the performance kit with springs (T2 front and rear) for 135i from a friend for small price. The front bar included has part number 31356773552

I assume that in this kit the dampers are stiffer than the E93 M sport suspension even if it is for 135i.

I will do these tests:

See if the dampers performance kit for 135i are stiffer than my E93 M sport dampers
See if the front bar in the performance kit for 135i is stiffer than the one I have on E93

Will use only the yellow T2 front springs and leave the original black M sport springs at the rear because there isn't any yellow spring for the heavy E93 rear.

Hope this will work.... will keep you updated with my findings.
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      03-15-2009, 10:01 AM   #103
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correcting me:
The front bar of both E90-92 and 135i performance kit is 31356773522
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      03-15-2009, 01:50 PM   #104
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Cool man.
I didn't realize that the e93 cars had 15mm bars. I thought that was only the Xi cars.
I'm really looking forward to what you find.
I just picked up the M3 front sway from Harold from HP Autowerks.
Obviously BMW didn't want to include the M3 bar in with the performance suspension since, IMO, it would be too close to the handling of the M3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
Mr 5 i totally agree with you.

My situation is a little bit complicated:

1) There is no E93 BMW performance suspension kit, so I have to use the E90/92 Kit

2) There are no yellow performance rear springs to match the performance
shocks, E93 is heavier than E92 on the rear caused by the roof.

3) E93 with M sport suspension has 15mm rear bar and 26.5mm 31356772353 front bar. the front bar is always 26.5mm but more or less stiffer depending in the part number

I got the performance kit with springs (T2 front and rear) for 135i from a friend for small price. The front bar included has part number 31356773552

I assume that in this kit the dampers are stiffer than the E93 M sport suspension even if it is for 135i.

I will do these tests:

See if the dampers performance kit for 135i are stiffer than my E93 M sport dampers
See if the front bar in the performance kit for 135i is stiffer than the one I have on E93

Will use only the yellow T2 front springs and leave the original black M sport springs at the rear because there isn't any yellow spring for the heavy E93 rear.

Hope this will work.... will keep you updated with my findings.
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      03-15-2009, 02:54 PM   #105
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fwiw I am thinking that the M3 front sway will be a good mod in combination with the more serious suspension changes.
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      03-15-2009, 03:08 PM   #106
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fwiw I am thinking that the M3 front sway will be a good mod in combination with the more serious suspension changes.
I agree. Are you thinking of doing it?
I just got the front sway from Harold and IMO, it will tie in the other M3 components to work even better.
I'm still against the rear M3 bar for my use, but there's a part of me that wishes that I would have gone slightly bigger than the 14mm just to see. (maybe the BMW 15mm or the Hotchkis 16mm bar) It's too bad that it's so much work to replace the rear bar or I would have tried out a bunch.

After I installed the springs, I noticed a big increase with the decreased amount of sway but the front sway bar will just make it even better!
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      03-15-2009, 07:09 PM   #107
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this thread contains a good bit of useful information - but is also so confusing!
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      03-15-2009, 08:07 PM   #108
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Yep, M3 front sway when I get $.
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      03-16-2009, 02:53 PM   #109
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i've been trying to decide on what to pull the trigger on - this or the kw street comfort - i think i'm going to go w/ this setup - i really just hope my car sits like mr. 5 or i'm going to be pissed off.... i HATE when the rear sits lower than the front.
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      03-18-2009, 03:16 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post

3) E93 with M sport suspension has 15mm rear bar and 26.5mm 31356772353 front bar. the front bar is always 26.5mm but more or less stiffer depending in the part number

The front bar included has part number 31356773552


I will do these tests:

See if the front bar in the performance kit for 135i is stiffer than the one I have on E93


Hope this will work.... will keep you updated with my findings.
Hoping to hear your review soon. Also, please do a comparison pic of the sway bars for us too! I wanna see if there really is a big difference!
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