[boostd92]

I read the instructions and saw that. In hindsight I kick myself for following the Kies video blindly (though they still might be right). I have to check the GFB to see if it had a flat. The hard part is that if it doesn't, and the stock DV did, I don't have a way to know, I bought the car with the GFB on it. I'll check it shortly.

[anjuna]

Originally Posted by boostd92

I read the instructions and saw that. In hindsight I kick myself for following the Kies video blindly (though they still might be right). I have to check the GFB to see if it had a flat. The hard part is that if it doesn't, and the stock DV did, I don't have a way to know, I bought the car with the GFB on it. I'll check it shortly.

I believe that you may be able to visually identify based on connector orientation (though I am not sure how accurate the TS instructions are in modeling the compressor assembly). Additionally, since it is installed, you may not have terrible difficulty with simply rotating the assembly.

Best of luck.

[boostd92]

Originally Posted by anjuna

I believe that you may be able to visually identify based on connector orientation (though I am not sure how accurate the TS instructions are in modeling the compressor assembly). Additionally, since it is installed, you may not have terrible difficulty with simply rotating the assembly.

Best of luck.

Thanks. It should be marginally easier since I've done it once now and know the tricks but these DV's aren't held in by anything but the bolts. When you undo the bolts, the thing just falls off and it's top heavy. I was truly amazed that I was able to hold the valve up there and get a bolt run in (there is seriously NO space to do this when it's in the car). I kept saying to myself, "hot damn that was lucky!"

I hope I have the same luck the second time around.

[anjuna]

Originally Posted by boostd92

Thanks. It should be marginally easier since I've done it once now and know the tricks but these DV's aren't held in by anything but the bolts. When you undo the bolts, the thing just falls off and it's top heavy. I was truly amazed that I was able to hold the valve up there and get a bolt run in (there is seriously NO space to do this when it's in the car). I kept saying to myself, "hot damn that was lucky!"

I hope I have the same luck the second time around.

Are you xdrive?

[boostd92]

I checked the GFB+ DV that I took off the car, and it does not have one single plumb back port on the valve itself - it has three 2-3mm diameter holes equidistant around the valve assembly (leading me to believe it can be installed in any orientation). I'm curious to see a stock one now. Maybe I can google some pics of the inside of the compressor housing with the DV removed.

[boostd92]

Can't find any definitive pictures on the web, but it looks like there is not a single port that plumbs back on the compressor housing, it's one circular dump area, so I don't believe it matters how you mount it in our application.

In the process though, I did find this on GFB's website:

"Using the main spring means the DV+ can open and close progressively in response to how much boost
pressure is present, unlike the factory diverter which just opens fully regardless of whether there is boost
to vent or not. Because this operation method is different from the factory diverter, it is not unusual or
detrimental to hear a different sound from the intake when lifting off the throttle at low RPM, especially
if you have an aftermarket intake or a larger turbo installed. "

Not having installed the GFB myself (it was on the car when I bought it), I was concerned with the noises it made, and the fact that it was constantly storing a "Bypass valve stuck closed" fault code, and I have a bigger turbo (PS2).

Realizing all of this is normal for the GFB, I may just put the GFB back on and sell the Turbosmart, just to put they money where it is needed more (I desperately need the Helix for E85 Fueling).

If anyone is interested in this valve, I may be selling it at a slight loss in a week or two, whenever I can find time to swap them.

[boostd92]

Originally Posted by anjuna

Are you xdrive?

No, RWD

[ferocity02]

The GFB DV+ can only be installed in one orientation. The three bolts into the compressor housing are not evenly spaced.

I'm getting used to the GFB DV+ blow off sounds, but NOT the constant moaning during medium throttle accel, worsened by SPORT mode.

[boostd92]

^^ Thank you, that's excellent info, though I may have to go measure myself If the GFB only goes in one way, then the Turbosmart can only go in one way as well.

I'm going to drive it around a bit more. My initial impression is that low/part throttle response is NOT as good as with the GFB. Reading the GFB instructions and info about the helper spring working to improve transitions that the stock DV does not (and the Turbosmart is the same design as the stock one) it might makes sense that I'm not imagining this.

A few more days of on road testing and I'll report back - plus I'll measure the 3 bolt hole distances - they look awfully equal to my naked eye!

[TheGoodTheBadTheUgly]

Originally Posted by boostd92

In the process though, I did find this on GFB's website:

"Using the main spring means the DV+ can open and close progressively in response to how much boost
pressure is present, unlike the factory diverter which just opens fully regardless of whether there is boost
to vent or not. Because this operation method is different from the factory diverter, it is not unusual or
detrimental to hear a different sound from the intake when lifting off the throttle at low RPM, especially
if you have an aftermarket intake or a larger turbo installed. "

Not having installed the GFB myself (it was on the car when I bought it), I was concerned with the noises it made, and the fact that it was constantly storing a "Bypass valve stuck closed" fault code, and I have a bigger turbo (PS2).

Realizing all of this is normal for the GFB, I may just put the GFB back on and sell the Turbosmart, just to put they money where it is needed more (I desperately need the Helix for E85 Fueling).

That makes so much more sense, because it is written everywhere in the GFB installation that the sound will change just because of the way this valve work. If you never installed it you never couls of known. It is very different from the diaphragm type we had.

I don't want to sound annoying or anything but I did mention that the GFB DV+ was the most proven upgrade for a DV on our system, because it is very truly exceptionnaly engineered. It is such a simple concept, but adaptes to work perfectlt with our application.

So in general, you feel the throttle/turbo response wasn't good or slugish with the turbosmart DV?

[ferocity02]

Originally Posted by boostd92

^^ Thank you, that's excellent info, though I may have to go measure myself If the GFB only goes in one way, then the Turbosmart can only go in one way as well.

Hmm... looking at online photos it would appear the three holes are evenly spaced. I may have been mistaken! The stock solenoid has an alignment dowel such that it can only be installed one way onto the turbo. However, the GFB DV+ essentially eliminates this dowel, so perhaps it can be installed in any of the three possible orientations. The GFB DV+ appears to by symmetric, so I don't think it would care which way it's installed.

Mine is installed with the plug pointing out the passenger side like this:

[anjuna]

Right... but he's TS now....
The GFB is a less superior product IMO

[katsooba]

i have a spare dv+ at my garage, i can measure the bolt spacing for you guys if you'd like

[boostd92]

Originally Posted by ferocity02

Hmm... looking at online photos it would appear the three holes are evenly spaced. I may have been mistaken!

Indeed. I went out and measured and the DV bolts on the GFB (and therefore stock, TS) are 61mm apart, equidistant.

Originally Posted by anjuna

Right... but he's TS now....
The GFB is a less superior product IMO

I'm not sure I believe that to be true in all ways. From actual experience, I think the GFB is superior in driveability (better throttle response, less lag, very noticeable). I think the TS is definitely superior in durability - it's one piece, and very strong, and doesn't require any "re-lube" or dissasembly that I'm finding common for the GFB. Though GFB says it does not need service, there are several instances on the net of the valves getting stuck or losing repsonsiveness and needing to be taken apart and re-greased. I will be putting my GFB back in and re-lubing it all beforehand.

Originally Posted by TheGoodTheBadTheUgly

I don't want to sound annoying or anything but I did mention that the GFB DV+ was the most proven upgrade for a DV on our system, because it is very truly exceptionnaly engineered. It is such a simple concept, but adaptes to work perfectlt with our application.

So in general, you feel the throttle/turbo response wasn't good or slugish with the turbosmart DV?

Yes, having back to back comparisons, I feel definite spool difference in throttle transitions - the TS feels like it's laggier than the GFB.

Without having access to the software to see how long the DME holds the DV open after throttle lift, it's impossible to know empirically. I could take some part throttle logs but I'm not sure it would catch it. What I do know is that the GFB description of the helper spring valve closing in that time period where the DME hasn't yet closed the DV surely makes sense based on the feel of the car with the GFB installed.

Especially on low, part throttle accelerations from a stop. If you're following a car ahead of you and you back off the throttle just a tiny bit, then get back on it, I noticed a significant lag with the Turbosmart valve that wasn't there when the GFB was installed.

That being said, I have the dual-port (partial atmosphere venting) version of the Turbosmart and the blow-off noise at higher boost levels is awesome - a perfect "KSHHHHH!" that the GFB does not make.

[boostd92]

Quick update - I re-installed the GFB DV+ last night after disassembling it and re-greasing it.

I can definitely tell a difference in transient spool - the GFB is noticeably quicker to build boost between on/off throttle transitions than the Turbosmart valve is. It doesn't make as nice a "whoosh" noise as the TS, but that's not as big of a concern to me.

To gum the data up some more, When I pulled the Turbosmart valve, I looked at the ports. It has a large port and a small port (the small port is the atmosphere dump, AFAIK) and they are at about 9 o'clock and 3 clock positions from each other (unlike the GFB which has 3 evenly spaced small circular ports). I tried to look at the DV hole on the turbo and if you are facing the compressor housing as it sits in the car, it appears the pressure exit from the compressor is at the 10 o'clock position, (this I can see by looking up from under the center of the car. The re-circulation port appears to be in the 3-4 o'clock position but you can't see it with the turbo in the car and everything else int he way - maybe with a mirror but I didn't have one. I stuck my finger in the DV hole and felt around and that's how I found it (I believe).

What gums up my comparison of the valves is if you install the TS valve with the pigtail pointing as close to the same as the stock/GFB (pigtail pointing approximately 9-10 o'clock), then the ports on the TS valve are actually in the 7 o'clock and 1 o'clock positions - not matching the ports on the turbo. Just by fiddling around, I think if I mounted the TS with the pigtail in the 11 o'clock position, the TS valve ports would better line up with the turbo ports.

In the end I'm not sure any of this even matters. If you look in the DV port, it's one big circular hole. Yes there are different holes that air comes in and goes out of, but they enter/exit into a big open bowl area (which explains why the stock/GVB DV exhaust ports don't line up with anything specific).

Based on the engineering/theory of the GFB DV+ helper spring, I'm not confident that rotating the TS will change anything about the less responsive transient throttle since (from the best I can determine on how both valves work), the stock like DVs will not close the valves as fast (or keep the valve closed in light throttle changes) as the GFB DV+.

Sorry if that was at all confusing. Just wanted to share my experience with it if anyone was curious.

Also important to note that I am a 01/2011 build date E90 N55 - so your results may vary if any of these relative parts changed at all in the F-chassis or later E-chassis N55 cars.

[ferocity02]

I don't think alignment of the DV port with the turbo port will make a huge difference. Like you said, the DV vents into a big open volume no matter what, the air would just have to travel an extra inch or so to get to the port in the turbo if the ports are not perfectly aligned.

My DV+ is causing compressor surge when venting above ~12psi. Pretty sure the DV is supposed to prevent that...

[boostd92]

I thought the noise i was hearing was compressor surge (choo-choo-choo-choo) but according to GFB, that noise is more likely the helper spring fluttering. That helper spring is not controlled by the DME - and that's why I get "Bypass valve stuck closed" faults stored.

That fluttering is actually keeping some small amount of boost in the charge pipes, and this is why it feels quicker to spool than the TS (and therefore stock) DV's I've tried. According to GFB, should be harmless - and Pure offers the GFB DV+ upgrade as part of a turbo build from them so I'll trust the experts for now.

I'm an old school turbo guy - I had an 88 Chrysler Conquest back in the day and my first big turbo build was a 1991 Talon - back then the BOV's were just one spring and a diaphragm - so if anything were fluttering it was bad (possibly).

[TheGoodTheBadTheUgly]

Yeah I told you that most upgraded turbos recommend DV+ as an upgrade. By retaining the solenoid part of the OEM design but switching the diaphragm style it is a more solid but even more efficient design than the carefully engineered stock DV.

The flutter sound with the, original diaphragm style diverter valve is due to the compressor surging, but with the DV+ spring and plunger style it is just a natural and normal noise apparently.

I am having overboosting issue and can still hear the chirping so it is most defenetly not always an indicative of surge, if you have the DV+.

[ferocity02]

The constant howling during medium throttle is unbearable. It howls constantly while cruising flat ground around 70mph. Seems to howl when boost is 0.7-1.5psi. Anyone else with DV+ have this issue???

Does the TS DV howl?

[katsooba]

Did you install the plunger springs correctly?
I cant see a reason why it would howl like in your video, maybe the plunger spring got damages in the install?
I am talking about the long thin spring, and not the short one with the larger diameter

Do you have all the orings intact and in place?
look at the attached pics i have the correct spring vs the stock spring laid out

[ferocity02]

Originally Posted by katsooba

Did you install the plunger springs correctly?
I cant see a reason why it would howl like in your video, maybe the plunger spring got damages in the install?
I am talking about the long thin spring, and not the short one with the larger diameter

Do you have all the orings intact and in place?
look at the attached pics i have the correct spring vs the stock spring laid out

Yes, everything is correct. I removed the valve and verified it was assembled correctly.

[TheGoodTheBadTheUgly]

Originally Posted by ferocity02

Yes, everything is correct. I removed the valve and verified it was assembled correctly.

I remember you saying that you had the Injen air intake. Did you try to replace it with the stock one to see how it changes the sound?