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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N55 Turbo Engine Tuning and Exhaust Modifications - 335i Tuning > N55 down pipe fix found!



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      02-06-2015, 03:24 PM   #23
Mike@N54Tuning.com
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335m View Post
Not to be argumentative or off topic, but can you please elaborate on the above bold statement?

I know Cobb n55 OTS maps leave something to be desired but the N54 maps are pretty much the same aren't they? I thought the consensus on this forum is that JB4 will get you what you want with one package but if you go Cobb you need to get a Protune to squeeze more power out of the Cobb maps whether you are n54 or n55.
You are correct, even on the N54 the COBB is best with a custom map, while the JB4 is ready optimally out of the box.

On the N55 the custom flashes are not as refined, and COBB doesn't support all N55 ECU Rom's so its hit an miss. Which is why I say not refined. From customer feedback I am also told the OTS on the N55 aren't as good as the ones on the N54.

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      02-06-2015, 04:07 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com View Post
You are correct, even on the N54 the COBB is best with a custom map, while the JB4 is ready optimally out of the box.

On the N55 the custom flashes are not as refined, and COBB doesn't support all N55 ECU Rom's so its hit an miss. Which is why I say not refined. From customer feedback I am also told the OTS on the N55 aren't as good as the ones on the N54.

Mike
Thanks for explaining, that makes sense. I tend to forget that Cobb cannot communicate with 2012+ n55's, so they really only have one year they can tune. From this most people could expect the quality of a map used for such a small set of vehicles would not be as refined as a tune used on a range of cars from 06-2010.
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      02-06-2015, 11:18 PM   #25
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Sorry all I've been really busy with work and ironically getting my pa emissions license lol....i did get around to scan my car and it came up no dtcs in the car all monitors are set but 1 which is evap....not sure exactly why it isnt set because i cleared it a week ago but as the car sits it will pass PA emissions test with 1 not set monitor

Note-i don't drive hard often, only sometimes when the time is right.

Its been around 120 miles so far. Usually the light will come on in around 10-15 miles of any type of driving.

I like this because i have CPO on my car and id like to know when the check engine light comes on besides the fact of my cat so i can get it covered without a hassle
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      02-10-2015, 07:49 AM   #26
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Good to know, that EVAP monitor takes forever to pass readiness.
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      02-10-2015, 08:49 AM   #27
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I believe the way to get EVAP ready is to start the car, idle for a few minutes, drive a bit and then when you park, idle for another 3-5 minutes.
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      02-14-2015, 10:14 AM   #28
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So yesterday my bms intake came in. Threw it on last night. Drove it about 10 miles. Slept. Woke up this morning and started my car, after about a mile my cel came on for the cat :/ i cleared it. maybe its seeing more air than usual and the dme will learn itself out. Than again i just put a bmw performance exhaust on tuesday and i have been driving prettttty aggressively


^clip of my car with the bmw pe and vrsf dp
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      02-15-2015, 11:50 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Mbrown335i View Post
So yesterday my bms intake came in. Threw it on
BMS intake is hot air intake, it reduces horsepower and creates more problems. Stock intake is not restrictive.
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      02-15-2015, 07:09 PM   #30
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I wouldn't take that advice too seriously, I've had the BMS Performance Intake and run into no issues. It sounds much nicer, but don't expect performance gains.

If you are worried about temps that much just grab the FMIC.
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      02-15-2015, 08:30 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbrown335i View Post
I have not scanned it to check readiness. I live in PA which requires these monitors to be set to pass emissions every year. I will scan it when I get off work to see if they set and I will let you know
I live in PA too but they don't do an obd check on my car. Only visual inspection.
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      02-15-2015, 08:36 PM   #32
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There is no real fix for the N55, and that's the truth.

Just push the car hard enough and a CEL will come easily with downpipes- it's that simple.
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      02-15-2015, 10:53 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335m
I wouldn't take that advice too seriously, I've had the BMS Performance Intake and run into no issues. It sounds much nicer, but don't expect performance gains.

If you are worried about temps that much just grab the FMIC.
BMS intake is better for sound and look, no problems running it in about 2+ years
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      02-16-2015, 10:36 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakentt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbrown335i View Post
So yesterday my bms intake came in. Threw it on
BMS intake is hot air intake, it reduces horsepower and creates more problems. Stock intake is not restrictive.
Any proof for this? Seems like people either love it or hate it
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      02-16-2015, 12:26 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsoboti
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakentt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbrown335i View Post
So yesterday my bms intake came in. Threw it on
BMS intake is hot air intake, it reduces horsepower and creates more problems. Stock intake is not restrictive.
Any proof for this? Seems like people either love it or hate it
Intakes don't provide any real performance gains- it's all about the sound- and if you love that wooshing blow off valve- like turbo sound then this is your intake for sure.

Truth be told however, it sometimes does get old- hence why I bought and sold mine three times over the course of two years
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      02-16-2015, 12:35 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Knight_335 View Post
There is no real fix for the N55, and that's the truth.

Just push the car hard enough and a CEL will come easily with downpipes- it's that simple.
This. Not sure why people are not believing it. Until a true DP fix comes out from an actual company specializing in stuff like this, there is no work around.

All companies that had been looking into them have failed and given up.
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      02-22-2015, 09:16 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by divisionbell77 View Post
This. Not sure why people are not believing it. Until a true DP fix comes out from an actual company specializing in stuff like this, there is no work around.

All companies that had been looking into them have failed and given up.
Any particular reason?
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      02-22-2015, 09:23 PM   #38
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It must be truly THAT difficult. If it were possible, we would have a fix by now, in my humble opinion. Can someone prove otherwise?
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      02-22-2015, 11:31 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335m
I wouldn't take that advice too seriously, I've had the BMS Performance Intake and run into no issues. It sounds much nicer, but don't expect performance gains.

If you are worried about temps that much just grab the FMIC.
I would.....there are a bunch of dyno tests with stock airbox vs open element intakes and stock beat all of them with IAT. Why would you want to suck in hot air, or have to take that off for service. Get a k&N drop in (or another brand) and call it a day.
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      02-23-2015, 07:06 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e92proper View Post
I would.....there are a bunch of dyno tests with stock airbox vs open element intakes and stock beat all of them with IAT. Why would you want to suck in hot air, or have to take that off for service. Get a k&N drop in (or another brand) and call it a day.
There's a trade off between flow and intake temps in the upper rpm range where higher flow will produce more power than a slightly cooler intake temp, especially when you up boost levels.
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      02-23-2015, 07:12 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF View Post
There's a trade off between flow and intake temps in the upper rpm range where higher flow will produce more power than a slightly cooler intake temp, especially when you up boost levels.
Thanks Tiago, I recall reading through the threads on intakes and K&D Filters and I chose an intake. Then I read that the higher temp offsets any gains in unrestricted flow and wanted to kick myself in the ass.

Cool sound aside and with the FMIC installed I think the intake makes sense.

Now, about that fix for the Down Pipe...........
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      02-23-2015, 12:06 PM   #42
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oh boy.. love how a lot of people love to talk out of there "a**." saying this, saying that about aftermarket intakes being un-beneficial, make less power, warmer IAT's..

In general, intakes if designed properly make power. just because the 335i doesn't make a tremendous amount in anyways doesn't mean it doesnt benefit. its a turboed car first of all, so IATs dont matter as much as an NA car. so you can suck in 3-4 degrees of warmer air and you'll experience no issue since the air will be warmed up soon after anyways. allowing the car to breath better, and less restrictive will help produce more power/tq. maybe not at peak but trust me theres a slight power increase. the more FBO and good tuning you get, the more power that intake will suffice.

to say an intake doesn't increase power and is only for sound... not true..

there are TONS of cars that have huge benefits from aftermarket intakes.

hell, my camaro before my 335i had a before and after dyno where my intake that was smack right in the engine bay with 5-6 degrees higher IAT's was making 16-17 RWHP more then the stock air box. for $350, it was a night and day difference.

although the stock airbox is good, it won't pull as much as a BMS for example, which it needs if your running higher boost..
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      02-23-2015, 12:19 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anthony. View Post
oh boy.. love how a lot of people love to talk out of there "a**." saying this, saying that about aftermarket intakes being un-beneficial, make less power, warmer IAT's..

In general, intakes if designed properly make power. just because the 335i doesn't make a tremendous amount in anyways doesn't mean it doesnt benefit. its a turboed car first of all, so IATs dont matter as much as an NA car. so you can suck in 3-4 degrees of warmer air and you'll experience no issue since the air will be warmed up soon after anyways. allowing the car to breath better, and less restrictive will help produce more power/tq. maybe not at peak but trust me theres a slight power increase. the more FBO and good tuning you get, the more power that intake will suffice.

to say an intake doesn't increase power and is only for sound... not true..

there are TONS of cars that have huge benefits from aftermarket intakes.

hell, my camaro before my 335i had a before and after dyno where my intake that was smack right in the engine bay with 5-6 degrees higher IAT's was making 16-17 RWHP more then the stock air box. for $350, it was a night and day difference.

although the stock airbox is good, it won't pull as much as a BMS for example, which it needs if your running higher boost..
I agree with most of what you said except for the idea that IAT's don't matter in turbo cars.

That is total rubbish and horseshit.

Look at speed density tuned cars. They go based off IAT's. And guess what, most people who have their cars tuned speed density style, have their IAT sensor put in the last bit of the intake tract right before the runners to the difference cylinders. IAT's are super important especially when no maf is present. Along with the MAF the IAT can provide a much more precise measurement of the total volume of air going into the engine. MAF alone means nothing because turbulence of the air can cause the MAF to read incorrectly. If an IAT reads warmer, it affects the fueling and timing.
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      02-23-2015, 01:23 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trixdout View Post
I agree with most of what you said except for the idea that IAT's don't matter in turbo cars.

That is total rubbish and horseshit.

Look at speed density tuned cars. They go based off IAT's. And guess what, most people who have their cars tuned speed density style, have their IAT sensor put in the last bit of the intake tract right before the runners to the difference cylinders. IAT's are super important especially when no maf is present. Along with the MAF the IAT can provide a much more precise measurement of the total volume of air going into the engine. MAF alone means nothing because turbulence of the air can cause the MAF to read incorrectly. If an IAT reads warmer, it affects the fueling and timing.
A MAF sensor has a temperature sensor already in it (it has to have one to even function). That's how they work. They have a heater that heats a known size block that is located in the center of the pipe. It is set to keep a constant temp on that block in closed loop. Airflow correlates to the voltage required to keep that block at known temp (assuming laminar flow). More flow, more heat lost in flow, ie more voltage required to heat. That process correlates airflow directly to voltage. Turbulent flow uses a different equation for convective cooling so this is how MAF can break down and give improper readings once flow turns turbulent.

Speed density cars need IAT because there is no inherent compensation for changing ambient temps like you have in MAF cars. Speed density is generally a less desirable (IMO) way of loading because it does not adapt well to changes in volumetric efficiency like MAF does, and can have poor resolution during low rpms. It can be much smoother (on boost) in a turbo car, but a more efficient intake/exhaust can shift the entire fueling map quite a bit requiring a re-tune. It doesn't necessarily matter where the IAT temp is (before compressor inlet or after IC), just as long as it is tuned per that location.

The reason that IAT don't matter as much in turbo cars is that the IC is usually capable of cooling a slight difference in IAT anyway (they have some cooling headroom). Sure the air coming in is 10F hotter, but the IC just cools it down so it's only approximately 2F hotter when it goes into the engine. It is theoretically better to have lower IAT, but not as much as what you think. Generally, flow optimization is more important for max HP. A short ram intake almost always flows significantly better than a longer, serpentine CAI routed to the fender area.

It's better to get ALL 100% of the air to compress, than it is to get 90% of the cold air. Just pulling numbers out of my posterior, to illustrate my point. Stock intakes on these cars are horribly designed from BMW with respect to flow. Once big turbos are norm, you will see well designed intakes making big power IMO. I don't feel we have well designed intakes yet because they mostly keep the stock elbow at the compressor inlet, and have a great deal of bends in the piping. They are fine for most stock turbo cars, but will restrict HP as bigger turbos come onto the market.

E90 Packaging is horrible on these cars around the turbo, so I see why various companies did not want to relocate everything to fit an uncompromised intake solution in them. It doesn't mean that "intakes don't make power". It just means that the average turbo (ie oem) is too small to realize significant intake gains with aftermarket intakes.....that re-use most of what makes the stock intake a poor design with respect to HP.
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