[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by AlexN

Is there any additional information available on the new VRSF 7" HD core?
I see the option available to order, but no real information on what he difference is compared to the standard 7" core

It's a denser fin pack.

I'd personally rate the VRSF FMIC options as follows:

-Mild Bolt on and climate 5" FMIC

-Full Bolt on and or hotter climate 7" FMIC

-Full Bolt on and hot climate 7" HD

-Upgraded Turbo(s) 7"HD or 7.5" Race FMIC (Depends on power level)

Of course there are some grey areas for these recommendations, it's just a rough area of where you should be in terms of FMIC, Power and Climate.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by AlexN

Thank you. Also, I see it is not a stepped design.
Any information on pressure drop with the higher density of the fins?
Will it induce more lag?

No it is not a stepped core , only the 7.5" is.

I do not have any data on the pressure drop, but you will not notice more lag from the 7" intercooler

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by AlexN

Thank you. Also, I see it is not a stepped design.
Any information on pressure drop with the higher density of the fins?
Will it induce more lag?

.7 psi pressure drop which is .2 more than stock. No noticeable lag.

[blueyedN54]

Originally Posted by E92 420

Iv had 2 intercoolers my first was the active Autowerk sport FMIC the company has a good rep, it has a high density core, the build quality and finish were lovely but man it was terrible at cooling. Typical temps in a WOT pull from 3rd to 5th were 145 -160f so I ditched it in favour of a CX racing FMIC which is a cheap China option with a low density fin pack and seriously in the same ambient temps on the same set up and tune after Multiple WOT pulls my IAT's now never rise above 110F and my WGDC are slightly lower. So how does that work???

I have been having trouble deciding what type of FMIC I want for my e93 but have been leaning towards the cx racing one since my buddy has one in his Honda and seems to be working good. I'm new here and been doing lots of reading about this subject and would like to make a firm decision on what to buy cause I don't want crappy product. Would you give me more info on this FMIC from them and the installation, mods needed etc? This would be great help.

[JM98]

Originally Posted by blueyedN54

I have been having trouble deciding what type of FMIC I want for my e93 but have been leaning towards the cx racing one since my buddy has one in his Honda and seems to be working good. I'm new here and been doing lots of reading about this subject and would like to make a firm decision on what to buy cause I don't want crappy product. Would you give me more info on this FMIC from them and the installation, mods needed etc? This would be great help.

Vendors will argue that these suck due to the "low density" of the fin pack, but I really think frontal surface area has more impact than anything. I run an e60 map stock turbos and have absolutely no heat soak issues.



Here's mine next to the oem intercooler, just keep in mind you'll have to do some trimming to make it fit.

[Tiago@VRSF]

Our HD Race core is about the same height with a denser fin pack. To say it's only vendors who claim a higher density fin pack will outperform a non dense fin pack is both misleading and untrue. A denser fin pack of the same volume will always outperform a less dense fin pack of the same volume. As you mentioned, total surface area is what creates the best heat transfer. The more fins, the more heat transfer.

Our race core is $720 shipped and it'll outperform the CX/BT FMIC and it'll bolt on to your existing chargepipe/turbo without having to piece together a bunch of pipes. By the time you piece the CX/BT kit together you're going to be close to that with an inferior product that lacks any sort of resale value.

[JM98]

I was at $250 out the door with intercooler and charge piping shipped. For my needs it works great.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by JM98

I was at $250 out the door with intercooler and charge piping shipped. For my needs it works great.

Did you log before and after IAT and pressure drop?

[JM98]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Did you log before and after IAT and pressure drop?

I log regularly, but don't really have an apples to apples comparison for you guys.

Other than the logistics of it, Im curious why any of the vendors haven't posted an actual side by side comparison of the N54 intercoolers (and not just their offerings own). Same day testing on the same dyno with the only change being the FMIC to show actual differences. Might actually put to rest all the back and forth on the topic.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by JM98

I log regularly, but don't really have an apples to apples comparison for you guys.

Other than the logistics of it, Im curious why any of the vendors haven't posted an actual side by side comparison of the N54 intercoolers (and not just their offerings own). Same day testing on the same dyno with the only change being the FMIC to show actual differences. Might actually put to rest all the back and forth on the topic.

It has been discussed to death in a million other threads, i do not intend to derail this thread similar to what happened with the other ones.

Short answer, a new Ebay knock off intercooler pops up every day ... No company is going to spend their money on buying intercoolers just for the sake of doing a comparison

What all the logs have shown is that anything is better than stock, but none of the ebay intercoolers is on the same level as any quality brand one.

I would rather spending an extra $150 and get a quality intercooler that will get me cooler IAT, less pressure drop and noticeable performance gains.

[JM98]

I wasn't here for debate, just posting my experience for blueyedn54.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by JM98

I wasn't here for debate, just posting my experience for blueyedn54.

i understand, i was just answering your question on why a direct comparison against all the Ebay intercooler is not possible.

We are happy to do a comparison as long as the customer supplies the non brand one.

[JunkyardDogg]

Will a 7" with low density outperform a 5" with high density?

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by JunkyardDogg

Will a 7" with low density outperform a 5" with high density?

Depends on the fin density of each one

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by JunkyardDogg

Will a 7" with low density outperform a 5" with high density?

It depends on which intercooler. Our 7" street will outperform most 5" stepped options due to overall capacity and surface area alone.

[JunkyardDogg]

So which smaller fmic has the highest density? ETS? ER?

[Tiago@VRSF]

A stock sized intercooler (5" non-stepped) is going to be a flow restriction once you increase boost and increase airflow. The OEM sized intercoolers can't keep up with the increased flow and become a restriction above 400whp.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by JunkyardDogg

So which smaller fmic has the highest density? ETS? ER?

Im assuming you mean 5" by smaller sized intercooler?
Highest density would be Wagner EVO 1 and ETS 5"

If you go to the 7", you got the VRSF 7" high density and the Wagner EVO 2

Evolution Racewerks would be highest density 6" on the market

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Im assuming you mean 5" by smaller sized intercooler?
Highest density would be Wagner EVO 1 and ETS 5"

If you go to the 7", you got the VRSF 7" high density and the Wagner EVO 2

Evolution Racewerks would be highest density 6" on the market

To be fair the Wagner EVO 2 is a 6" core (5.9").

Our 7" HD is denser than both the Wagner and the ER.

Here's a picture of our HD fin pack on both our 7" HD and 7.5" Race core. I'll post a comparison pic of the ER vs VRSF HD when I get back into the shop:

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

To be fair the Wagner EVO 2 is a 6" core (5.9").

Our 7" HD is denser than both the Wagner and the ER.

Here's a picture of our HD fin pack on both our 7" HD and 7.5" Race core. I'll post a comparison pic of the ER vs VRSF HD when I get back into the shop:

I was answering his question about highest density per size.
If the question is which is the highest density intercooler, its the 7" VRSF HD

[JunkyardDogg]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Im assuming you mean 5" by smaller sized intercooler?
Highest density would be Wagner EVO 1 and ETS 5"

If you go to the 7", you got the VRSF 7" high density and the Wagner EVO 2

Evolution Racewerks would be highest density 6" on the market

Ok thanks!

I've narrowed it down to either the ETS 5" or VRSF 7"

[Torgus]

Originally Posted by JunkyardDogg

Ok thanks!

I've narrowed it down to either the ETS 5" or VRSF 7"

go VRSF 7"