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      02-17-2018, 08:25 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insanecoder View Post
not questioning that humans in general are violent.. the history books are quite telling
however violence taken to the level of mass shootings such as here in the USA is clearly on the rise
ergo the soul-searching as to the potential cause.. I too believe its the culture and the acceptance of violence as a solution to everything esp in movies/tv/games.. I suspect we both have lived and seen gentler times..

guns been around since the beginning and easy to obtain since the beginning and its only gotten tougher for the general populace to obtain
that cant be the sole cause

I think the writer is correct, Americans live in a violent culture which is becoming more violent with people becoming desensitized
not saying all people.. just more and more as time goes on it seems
I agree 100% with the bolded, but I also believe that it stems from a loss of teaching respect for authority and enforcing it. Toady, parents, teachers, police, etc. are shown no respect and they have little authority in the eyes of the youth of America. I can't believe the things that I hear kids saying to those who should have authority over them. We have also lost our sense of right and wrong - there is no longer a moral yardstick. Anything goes.
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      02-17-2018, 08:53 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
I agree 100% with the bolded, but I also believe that it stems from a loss of teaching respect for authority and enforcing it. Toady, parents, teachers, police, etc. are shown no respect and they have little authority in the eyes of the youth of America. I can't believe the things that I hear kids saying to those who should have authority over them. We have also lost our sense of right and wrong - there is no longer a moral yardstick. Anything goes.
While I still see some nice kids around, I have detected an increase of what you are talking about. It's getting worse, not better. Having raised two of my own, I believe the lion's share of these problems begin at home - with the parents. Their first error is setting bad examples, and I've witnessed this first-hand, even in our church (well, a couple of the churches I used to attend). We got so disgusted, we left. Twice.
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      02-17-2018, 09:48 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
I agree 100% with the bolded, but I also believe that it stems from a loss of teaching respect for authority and enforcing it. Toady, parents, teachers, police, etc. are shown no respect and they have little authority in the eyes of the youth of America. I can't believe the things that I hear kids saying to those who should have authority over them. We have also lost our sense of right and wrong - there is no longer a moral yardstick. Anything goes.
I blame social media for turning all these kids into vain and egotistical pricks. They’re all fighting for attention from people they don’t even know. Fucking stupid.
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      02-17-2018, 09:51 PM   #26
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I blame social media for turning all these kids into vain and egotistical pricks. They’re all fighting for attention from people they don’t even know. Fucking stupid.
Agree that it is part of the problem - it has definitely ruined our society and meaningful communication.
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      02-17-2018, 10:06 PM   #27
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I also think diet is part of the problem. Being serious here.
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      02-17-2018, 10:08 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insanecoder View Post
not questioning that humans in general are violent.. the history books are quite telling
however violence taken to the level of mass shootings such as here in the USA is clearly on the rise
ergo the soul-searching as to the potential cause.. I too believe its the culture and the acceptance of violence as a solution to everything esp in movies/tv/games.. I suspect we both have lived and seen gentler times..

guns been around since the beginning and easy to obtain since the beginning and its only gotten tougher for the general populace to obtain
that cant be the sole cause

I think the writer is correct, Americans live in a violent culture which is becoming more violent with people becoming desensitized
not saying all people.. just more and more as time goes on it seems
Quote:
Originally Posted by SakhirM4 View Post
I agree 100% with the bolded, but I also believe that it stems from a loss of teaching respect for authority and enforcing it. Toady, parents, teachers, police, etc. are shown no respect and they have little authority in the eyes of the youth of America. I can't believe the things that I hear kids saying to those who should have authority over them. We have also lost our sense of right and wrong - there is no longer a moral yardstick. Anything goes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3.0L View Post
While I still see some nice kids around, I have detected an increase of what you are talking about. It's getting worse, not better. Having raised two of my own, I believe the lion's share of these problems begin at home - with the parents. Their first error is setting bad examples, and I've witnessed this first-hand, even in our church (well, a couple of the churches I used to attend). We got so disgusted, we left. Twice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aozer View Post
I blame social media for turning all these kids into vain and egotistical pricks. They’re all fighting for attention from people they don’t even know. Fucking stupid.
You each win the tag team internet of the day. Congratulations!!

The question of gun violence is a multifaceted question which can't be easily answered. The analogy of drunk driving has merit but isn't entirely congruent. We need to address the devaluation of human life at all levels as well as the general lack of empathy in society. Guns are tools. People make decisions and pull triggers just as people make decisions to drive while intoxicated.
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      02-17-2018, 10:53 PM   #29
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why can't we just agree regardless of mental illness. because honestly if anyone has read the DSM ...everyone has something..so why can't the shooters just be cowardly, sick, fucked up people
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      02-17-2018, 11:13 PM   #30
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America doesn't have a gun problem, we've got a "Violent & Defiant Youth" problem. Pleaser type parents R losing control at earlier ages as they abandon biblical discipline. The couple that adopted these 2 boys, were already close to 50. Too Old. These boys were probably never spanked. No Discipline means No Fear. No Fear can become Violent. This young man had several 'enablers' to a killing spree. Who gave him the money to buy all these arms and ammo? He didn't do it all himself. I promise you. "When helping, hurts!"
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      02-17-2018, 11:19 PM   #31
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why can't we just agree regardless of mental illness. because honestly if anyone has read the DSM ...everyone has something..so why can't the shooters just be cowardly, sick, fucked up people
Because America gave blacks, mexicans, and muslims that profile.
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      02-18-2018, 12:30 AM   #32
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I think it is time to look at these shootings as a symptom rather than an illness. We have always had evil souls amongst us. We have had easy access to firearms for many years before mass shootings. Each generation has said the next is worse and less moral.

My question is where does this go? Our nation is more divided than ever. Our "leaders" cannot be trusted. Our country is ruled by money and the mob.
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      02-18-2018, 01:09 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Incontinentia Buttocks View Post
As someone battling mental illness, I find it highly offensive that mental illness is being used as a scapegoat. The facts are that mental illness doesn't make me more likley to commit acts of violence. It makes me more likley to be on the receiving end of violence.

Frankly some of the ill informed comments on this forum about some of the most vunerable people in society is sickening.

I'm sorry to hear you are dealing with mental health issues. I hope you are taking care of yourself and getting care for your illness. There's much we don't yet understand about mental illness and the tools we have to treat it, while effective for some, are not for others. While many people find help and relief from their symptoms from the many different antidepressants we have available, others are adversely effected. Common antidepressants, for some people, can lead to serious issues with anger and rage.

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...-behavior.aspx

It's possible that our preferred methods for treating mental illness in the US (throw drugs at the problem and hope it just goes away) may be contributing to some of the increases in violence we are seeing in our society.
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      02-18-2018, 01:20 AM   #34
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I'm sorry to hear you are dealing with mental health issues. I hope you are taking care of yourself and getting care for your illness. There's much we don't yet understand about mental illness and the tools we have to treat it, while effective for some, are not for others. While many people find help and relief from their symptoms from the many different antidepressants we have available, others are adversely effected. Common antidepressants, for some people, can lead to serious issues with anger and rage.

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...-behavior.aspx

It's possible that our preferred methods for treating mental illness in the US (throw drugs at the problem and hope it just goes away) may be contributing to some of the increases in violence we are seeing in our society.
Im going to try to keep this as short as possible.

SSRI cause so many deaths because majority of the patients use them to overdose. They clinically depressed and their medicine doesn't work. Serotonin syndrome has a very low incidence and the CYP mutations are existent however, most studies that were done were flawed.

Furthermore, for someone who thinks about shooting anyone needs something way beyond your daily dose of prozac. They need to be on high-dose antipsychotics to be sedated. Antipsychotics are used for aggression.

Now I will also say that you can't just throw drugs at the problem. Most people need counseling and behavior therapy. But to say the drugs are causing this is quite the stretch. I know America is cracked out on prescription drugs but seriously for someone to shoot up a school. You gotta have weeks of planning and intent.
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      02-18-2018, 02:10 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G35POPPEDMYCHERRY View Post
Im going to try to keep this as short as possible.

SSRI cause so many deaths because majority of the patients use them to overdose. They clinically depressed and their medicine doesn't work. Serotonin syndrome has a very low incidence and the CYP mutations are existent however, most studies that were done were flawed.

Furthermore, for someone who thinks about shooting anyone needs something way beyond your daily dose of prozac. They need to be on high-dose antipsychotics to be sedated. Antipsychotics are used for aggression.

Now I will also say that you can't just throw drugs at the problem. Most people need counseling and behavior therapy. But to say the drugs are causing this is quite the stretch. I know America is cracked out on prescription drugs but seriously for someone to shoot up a school. You gotta have weeks of planning and intent.
I'm not saying "caused". But potentially a contributing factor. One of many factors that have to be considered.
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      02-18-2018, 02:32 AM   #36
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This is a farce. Americans are not anymore violent then anyone else. Having travelled to many parts of the world (and not to the big cities with luxury hotels) I would say we are on the whole less violent then most places in this world.

Nor do we have much of a problem with violent culture. There are many more places with cultures of violence who are watching the same movies and playing the same games. Have any of you watched Korean movies. Our concept of violence in film can see quant sometimes.

This article and this whole concept is yet again a fanciful attempt to try to place blame somewhere while avoiding the reality we are living in.

As I mentioned in another thread a large proportion of people right now are complete addicts to something and are simply incapable of seeing the truth or reality so now they concoct this notion of us having a violent culture.

We do not have a violent culture or a problem with violence anymore then any other place. What we have an epidemic of right now is sociopathy. Sociopathy which is being spread like wildfire because of the internet.

Accept it? Of course not. But the truth does not require those of feeble mind to accept it. It will remain the truth regardless of what an addict thinks.

But go ahead let's blame "mental disease" or "violent movies" or "violent video games" and see how things are in a year from now. What a farce. And yes as a poster above mentioned, blaming "mental health" for this is beyond stupid.

Maybe we will start hearing chants for all mental health patients to condemn these acts and apologize they way is demanded after terrorist attacks. Hah.

The only question is at what point will a critical mass of people coalesce and realize the reality that the internet is literally spreading sociopathy like the flu.
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      02-18-2018, 02:57 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bingobimmer View Post
I think it is time to look at these shootings as a symptom rather than an illness. We have always had evil souls amongst us. We have had easy access to firearms for many years before mass shootings. Each generation has said the next is worse and less moral.

My question is where does this go? Our nation is more divided than ever. Our "leaders" cannot be trusted. Our country is ruled by money and the mob.
It most be a rare symptom only found in America among certain people. If I was to look at this like I do science then modern American culture and social media is becoming black noise in the heads of certain people who cant handle it and could in fact be a genetic thing.



Imagine if you could listen to the thoughts of everyone how insane that will drive you ? Well social media is expressing other people's views and thoughts and if your not careful you'll absorb that shit not being able to process it.

Now I have never lived in Europe or Canada so I dont know how their culture intertwines with social media, so my theory maybe a dud

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      02-18-2018, 11:53 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by c63er View Post
This is a farce. Americans are not anymore violent then anyone else. Having travelled to many parts of the world (and not to the big cities with luxury hotels) I would say we are on the whole less violent then most places in this world.

Nor do we have much of a problem with violent culture. There are many more places with cultures of violence who are watching the same movies and playing the same games. Have any of you watched Korean movies. Our concept of violence in film can see quant sometimes.

This article and this whole concept is yet again a fanciful attempt to try to place blame somewhere while avoiding the reality we are living in.

As I mentioned in another thread a large proportion of people right now are complete addicts to something and are simply incapable of seeing the truth or reality so now they concoct this notion of us having a violent culture.

We do not have a violent culture or a problem with violence anymore then any other place. What we have an epidemic of right now is sociopathy. Sociopathy which is being spread like wildfire because of the internet.

Accept it? Of course not. But the truth does not require those of feeble mind to accept it. It will remain the truth regardless of what an addict thinks.

But go ahead let's blame "mental disease" or "violent movies" or "violent video games" and see how things are in a year from now. What a farce. And yes as a poster above mentioned, blaming "mental health" for this is beyond stupid.

Maybe we will start hearing chants for all mental health patients to condemn these acts and apologize they way is demanded after terrorist attacks. Hah.

The only question is at what point will a critical mass of people coalesce and realize the reality that the internet is literally spreading sociopathy like the flu.
Then why are these things happening way more often in the US than anywhere else in the civilized world?
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      02-18-2018, 12:29 PM   #39
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Then why are these things happening way more often in the US than anywhere else in the civilized world?
Why are terrorist attacks happening way more often in other countries besides the US and not in the US? Countries are not free from mass killings and focus on the US is blown way out of proportion. Do we have problems? Yes. Do they need to be worked and fixed? Yes. Should other countries be pointing their finger at the US and saying how bad life is? No. Life in the US is still far better than many, many places in this world. Thank you.
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      02-18-2018, 01:00 PM   #40
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Then why are these things happening way more often in the US than anywhere else in the civilized world?
I listened to an interesting podcast the other day about how politically motivated kidnappings are almost completely unheard of in the US but are quite common around the rest of the world. Whose to say why. For whatever reason, our society, our culture, our history, something about us in the US breeds more mass school shootings than other countries yet we are blissfully unaffected by politically motivated kidnappings.
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      02-18-2018, 01:35 PM   #41
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For people living outside of the states...we see it differently.
A Dutch TV Show (partly subtitles, mostly in English) presents a different perspective.
In any case...fun to watch:


Enjoy
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      02-18-2018, 01:42 PM   #42
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For people living outside of the states...we see it differently.
A Dutch TV Show (partly subtitles, mostly in English) presents a different perspective.
In any case...fun to watch:


Enjoy
Interesting first post in a BMW forum
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      02-18-2018, 01:53 PM   #43
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Interesting first post in a BMW forum
But member since years ;-)
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      02-18-2018, 03:41 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by c63er View Post
This is a farce. Americans are not anymore violent then anyone else. Having travelled to many parts of the world (and not to the big cities with luxury hotels) I would say we are on the whole less violent then most places in this world.

Nor do we have much of a problem with violent culture. There are many more places with cultures of violence who are watching the same movies and playing the same games. Have any of you watched Korean movies. Our concept of violence in film can see quant sometimes.

This article and this whole concept is yet again a fanciful attempt to try to place blame somewhere while avoiding the reality we are living in.

As I mentioned in another thread a large proportion of people right now are complete addicts to something and are simply incapable of seeing the truth or reality so now they concoct this notion of us having a violent culture.

We do not have a violent culture or a problem with violence anymore then any other place. What we have an epidemic of right now is sociopathy. Sociopathy which is being spread like wildfire because of the internet.

Accept it? Of course not. But the truth does not require those of feeble mind to accept it. It will remain the truth regardless of what an addict thinks.

But go ahead let's blame "mental disease" or "violent movies" or "violent video games" and see how things are in a year from now. What a farce. And yes as a poster above mentioned, blaming "mental health" for this is beyond stupid.

Maybe we will start hearing chants for all mental health patients to condemn these acts and apologize they way is demanded after terrorist attacks. Hah.

The only question is at what point will a critical mass of people coalesce and realize the reality that the internet is literally spreading sociopathy like the flu.
I guess in your travels, you haven't been to New Zealand?

That country seems to be getting it right. Really right. No discernible racism. Crime is so low, police officers don't even carry fire arms.
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