[mob17]

I want to upgrade my m sport suspension badly now.

I've been thinking about various options in the past 6 months. Ranging from springs only (lol), Birds, BMW Performance Suspension, Öhlins, AC Schnitzer, Bilstein and KW. I was hell bent on getting Öhlins but unfortunately i've decided its just going to be too pricey for me, even though it is an amazing piece of kit.

Now i've seen some Bilstein B14 PSS coilover kits at a very good price and it's got me buzzing. Around £710 delivered. I've tried to read some reviews but not many showing up.

What do you guys think of the B14 kit?

[RagingKileak]

I'd be tempted at that price. Is it a one off or can you share?

Matt

[Josh1a1h]

Nothing is worse than the high sitting, crasy Msport ride!!!

Firstly, if you really had your eyes set on the Ohlins...then definitely wait a little longer and get it. That kit speaks for itself!!! Probably one of the best kits out there which you can use comfortably daily, but has great track and B Road potential.
If you are looking for an aesthetically pleasing drop.... i am unsure of the spring options you have as most Ohlins spring seem to keep the car sitting a little too high, but still lower than msport.... Maybe there are other options out there?

I cannot comment on the B14's im afraid...but i did hear a while back that they were very stiff... But that is just hearsay...

As you have probably seen, people love the BC Coilovers which can be had for a fairly similar price... havent seen any negative feedback yet?

[parapaul]

Wasn't it the B14 PSS that Tony had fitted? If it was, he was VERY impressed with them.

[RagingKileak]

Tony has PSS10 w/ ride control I think Paul. It's a very well setup car, but I'd be willing to bet that if Tony was to do it again, he'd have Ohlins - they weren't available when his setup was done I don't think.

For me, these coilies sound very good for the money. After that, I'd be looking at Bilstein and Ohlins in that order - Ohlins reputation and performance is second to none, but it's not necessary unless you are marcel or tony and at the Ring every few weeks.

I can only laugh at the idea of comparing Ohlins/Birds and Bilstein stuff with BC. It's like comparing Premier League (albeit different quality teams) with an average championship side. There is no comparison and I wouldn't trust BC coilovers to keep me alive under hard use.

Matt

[Rudz]

I agree no comparison between BC and Bilstein, I'd be interested too at that price mob....

[lolololol]

It has to be the Birds setup surely ? Years of development and 1000's of satisfied customers, test car you can go out in and try before you buy. The kit has been developed for the E9x specifically, I will be buying a setup shortly and if anyone wants to see if we can leverage some economies of scale - let me know.

[mob17]

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

I'd be tempted at that price. Is it a one off or can you share?

Matt

Finders keepers

Lol, i've emailed about a group buy. But if you still want the link send me a pm

Originally Posted by Josh1a1h

Nothing is worse than the high sitting, crasy Msport ride!!!

Firstly, if you really had your eyes set on the Ohlins...then definitely wait a little longer and get it. That kit speaks for itself!!! Probably one of the best kits out there which you can use comfortably daily, but has great track and B Road potential.

I totally get what you're saying, and i have been waiting! It's been like 6-7 months. And in that time the RRP has gone up from £1710 to £1881!

I really wanted to get it once i sat in a car with it. But i just can't wait any longer. Sometimes you have to accept you just can't get what you want

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

Tony has PSS10 w/ ride control I think Paul. It's a very well setup car, but I'd be willing to bet that if Tony was to do it again, he'd have Ohlins - they weren't available when his setup was done I don't think.

For me, these coilies sound very good for the money. After that, I'd be looking at Bilstein and Ohlins in that order - Ohlins reputation and performance is second to none, but it's not necessary unless you are marcel or tony and at the Ring every few weeks.

Ohlins is a very sweet bit of kit. But like you say, i don't go track days (do plan to) and i guess i can settle for something "cheaper". Saying that Bilstein are obviously a good make and the normal RRP of the B14 PSS is around £900-1000 i think.

By the way guys, these aren't the PSS9's or PSS10's. Those ones have 9 and 10 damping adjustments. The B14 PSS has only height adjustment, which for the E92 335D is 30-50mm front and rear. For me damping adjustment isn't critical, but the ride height is something i'd like to be able to change up.

Originally Posted by Rudz

I agree no comparison between BC and Bilstein, I'd be interested too at that price mob....

I just sent the company an email asking if we were to buy 5 how much discount we could get.

But it would be nice to get some reviews of this kit first if possible.

Originally Posted by omaragha

It has to be the Birds setup surely ? Years of development and 1000's of satisfied customers, test car you can go out in and try before you buy. The kit has been developed for the E9x specifically, I will be buying a setup shortly and if anyone wants to see if we can leverage some economies of scale - let me know.

Birds is another great kit i was considering. However i want coilovers and the ability to change up the ride height, which i can do with the B14 PSS .

[mob17]

Guys just got some potentially good news re the Group Buy. The Bilstein part number is 47-120471. I've only checked the E92 335D/I and it fits both of them. It may fit others but please check.

Email

Hi,

if you buy 5 pices I can give you more discount.
You will pay for one 789,98€, that is for 5 pices 3949,90€. And if you pay with bank transfer you will get 2% extra discount of 3949,90€.
Transportation costs are not included in the price.

If you have any questions you can ask me.

With thanks and regards.

So if i'm understanding that properly, we buy 5 units for €3949.90. Then depending if we pay by bank transfer we get 2% off to bring it to a total of €3870.90. Which works out to roughly £650 + shipping.

I've also been cheeky and asked him to do the lot for €3800, less 2% bank transfer discount = €3724. Which works out to roughly £624 + shipping.

I've asked him how much it is to ship all the 5 units to one UK address, and how much it is to 5 separate ones. We could do whatever works out cheaper/easier.

Out of interest i've asked him what discount i would be for 10 units.

I'm hoping he will come down a little further from £650 plus shipping, but i've just been cheeky as it was already a good deal.

I hope there's interest in this?

[RagingKileak]

Hi all,

Here's my second 20p worth.

Omar, you're probably right about the4 Birds kit - it's fantastic and is definitely a much better upgrade for 99% of buyers than the Ohlins, because with fitting, is about half the price. I am now (at least of this morning) about 90% sure I was going to go with Birds, so if a group buy is on the cards then I would be interested in hearing the numbers.

THAT SAID.... You might be wondering why I said that the OP should be tempted by the Bilstein kit at this price. The answer is simple - most retailers are charging about £950+ for this kit, so at circa £650, it is VERY cheap and even if any one of us bought that kit and took the car for a proper suspension setup job, it would still be much cheaper than the Birds option.

I also concede this - even properly setup, the Bilstein B14 kit is unlikely to damp as effectively as the Birds kit, but it would provide a premium quality suspension kit for circa HALF the price of the Birds kit fitted. Plus, for those of you who like a drop - the Bilstein coilies would do more work for you than the Birds kit.

With these thoughts in mind, I have a few questions for you MOB.

I take it the supplier you're looking at is in Europe so no import duties to add?
Are you reasonably confident that they are a legit outfit? This is suspiciously cheap!
Have you included VAT or any equivalent local tax which might not have been accounted for?
Has anyone read any road tests or reviews about the B14 kit and where it sits in Bilstein's range?

If the outcome to the above is all good then I'd be seriously tempted to get in on this GB. I could pull the trigger anytime at this price, so let me know.

Omar likewise, if you want to organise a GB on the Birds kit, I would be interested in seeing the discount. I understand the standard price for the Birds kit is around £1200 inc VAT.

Matt

[mob17]

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

THAT SAID.... You might be wondering why I said that the OP should be tempted by the Bilstein kit at this price. The answer is simple - most retailers are charging about £950+ for this kit, so at circa £650, it is VERY cheap and even if any one of us bought that kit and took the car for a proper suspension setup job, it would still be much cheaper than the Birds option.

I also concede this - even properly setup, the Bilstein B14 kit is unlikely to damp as effectively as the Birds kit, but it would provide a premium quality suspension kit for circa HALF the price of the Birds kit fitted. Plus, for those of you who like a drop - the Bilstein coilies would do more work for you than the Birds kit.

Well said, i agree. I do want to get a nice drop as well, although nothing slammed. But we can't really say it won't damp as effective as the Birds kit? It could do?

With these thoughts in mind, I have a few questions for you MOB.

I take it the supplier you're looking at is in Europe so no import duties to add? Yep, in Germany
Are you reasonably confident that they are a legit outfit? This is suspiciously cheap! Yep, website looks legit. I'll send you the link if you want to check it out?
Have you included VAT or any equivalent local tax which might not have been accounted for? Nothing extra to pay as it's from Germany. Apart from the shipping of course.
Has anyone read any road tests or reviews about the B14 kit and where it sits in Bilstein's range? This is why i started this thread! I've read quite a few M5 reviews with this kit. Info http://www.bilstein.de/en/products/s.../bilstein-b14/ It seems that the only better coilovers Bilstein do are the B16 PSS9/10 ones. Come on hotcoupe where are you?!

If the outcome to the above is all good then I'd be seriously tempted to get in on this GB. I could pull the trigger anytime at this price, so let me know.

Omar likewise, if you want to organise a GB on the Birds kit, I would be interested in seeing the discount. I understand the standard price for the Birds kit is around £1200 inc VAT.

Matt

Final email from the contact just now:

Hi,
780€ is ok, but 760€ is to little.
For one it is 19,90€ shipping cost and we can send them to 5 different UK addresses.

With Thanks & Regards.

So its basically €780 x 5 = €3900. Less the 2% bank transfer discount and it comes up to €3822. Which is €764.40 plus €19.90 shipping = €784.30. Which is £657.41 shipped

I'm going to send another email asking about 10 units.

[RagingKileak]

Hi mate,

Would you mind PM'ing me the link - I have no reason to doubt them, just checking really! It might be worth us checking with Lars or Marcel (I will do that) as they are both German and may know the company.

Have you got any links for the reviews? I am feeling quite tempted by this so you can put me down on the list as a 'near certain' if things pan out for the best. All would change my mind is the Birds kit for less than £1000 which is very unlikely.

Matt

[mob17]

Sure pm on its way with the link. Would be good if your contacts could check, i dont have any doubts but would be a benefit to anyone considering this.

[RagingKileak]

PM received and question asked.

The site looks legit to me. I've found separate listings for 335i and 335d (both at same price) and the prices are close enough to the GB price that it doesn't appear they are deep discounting unrealistically. Also clearly shows the 2% bank transfer discount on the site and the full price does include the German equivalent of VAT.

I've also found an address for them.

Matt

[mob17]

Cool sounds good!

However i still would like to get some more opinions on the kit. The reviews i've read are only for M5's. I'd be slightly uncomfortable if we didn't get any other reviews/opinions

Then again i think: its Bilstein. Surely better than M Sport, but by how much.

I'm hoping someone can chime in with some feedback!

[RagingKileak]

I dunno to be honest. I suspect the only problem we're going to have is damping - they will be hard. Birds Bilstein dampers are setup in such a way that they are softer for everyday use than the M-Sport stuff is, but the B14 is likely to be quite hard - I had the B10 kit (I think, or B12) on my Golf and it was very compliant, but hard and a bit crashy.

My gut feeling is that the B14 kit will roll less than M-Sport, but be similarly hard over potholes etc - where I think the big win will be is that hard or not, Bilstein damping will be a lot more responsive than M-Sport, so you shouldn't experience that 'lack of control' over uneven surfaces that you do with M-Sport.

The Birds kit? Well it's softer and does allow some roll, but it firms up very quickly when used in anger - it's better than M-Sport in every way and probably more comfortable than the B14.

For me it's a straight price vs performance shoot out. Is the B14 kit cheap enough for me to swallow the fact that although I will be 100% better than stock, or should I spend twice as much money on the Birds kit and expect 150% better than stock?

Matt

[mob17]

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

I dunno to be honest. I suspect the only problem we're going to have is damping - they will be hard. Birds Bilstein dampers are setup in such a way that they are softer for everyday use than the M-Sport stuff is, but the B14 is likely to be quite hard - I had the B10 kit (I think, or B12) on my Golf and it was very compliant, but hard and a bit crashy.

My gut feeling is that the B14 kit will roll less than M-Sport, but be similarly hard over potholes etc - where I think the big win will be is that hard or not, Bilstein damping will be a lot more responsive than M-Sport, so you shouldn't experience that 'lack of control' over uneven surfaces that you do with M-Sport.

The Birds kit? Well it's softer and does allow some roll, but it firms up very quickly when used in anger - it's better than M-Sport in every way and probably more comfortable than the B14.

For me it's a straight price vs performance shoot out. Is the B14 kit cheap enough for me to swallow the fact that although I will be 100% better than stock, or should I spend twice as much money on the Birds kit and expect 150% better than stock?

Matt

Summed up nicely there. I hate the m sport lack of control, and if this introduces a nice planted firm (not harsh) ride, with a decent drop, then i'll be very happy.

I'm going to try and get more info on these. I'll email Bilstein and see what they say.

If anyone else can get some info it would be much appreciated.

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by mob17

£657.41 shipped

Wow, seems a bargain and at that price it's a no brainer.

A quick 'google' and UK prices are £900-£1000!

I paid £1400+ for the PSS10's and the only difference between the two kits is adjustable damping on the 10's.

It's worth bearing in mind that Bilstein manufacture OEM suspension for most of the leading marques, including BMW, Jaguar, Porsche to name just a few and their reputation precedes them.

The warranty is a lifetime one and they have a UK service centre where the customer care is second to none, and the Guy's couldn't be more helpful if they tried.

I loved my kit, the best part was by far the adjustability of the ride height, a must on our roads, fixed damping I could live with easily, and the Bilstein kit, even fixed, would be far better than the skittish and harsh MSport ride.

I'll leave you with a couple of questions:

Where do the parts that make up the Birds kit originate from?
Who conceived the kit and was instrumental in it's development?
What kit did the conceiver have fitted to his car when the concept was born?

The chances are that the Guy above would no doubt opt for the Ohlins a third time around, however he's probably done more laps on the ring than all of the members on this forum have done combined.
He knows the Ring better than some of us know the M25/South/North circular, so for a very, very few, the Ohlins would be a much better investment.

[RagingKileak]

Thanks for the feedback, all those things are the reason why I am more or less on board with this.

That said, I have had some sobering conversations with 'that guy' tonight and he has reminded me of the commonality of Bilstein dampers failing, which to be fair does seem to be quite regular. I believe you had 1 or 2 replaced yourself if I remember correctly?

I am also aware that Kevin Bird has had to swap out a fair number of them for his customers buying the Birds developed kit.

All that said, I didn't have any problem with them on my Golf and I did give it some abuse!

It's hard to know what the right thing to do is - but the price says a lot and at this kind of money I am still leaving my name in the hat!

Matt

[RagingKileak]

PS Lars (335rocks) has VERY kindly written me a detailed PM about the website in question here and advised that it looks fairly legit to him. I won't hold him to that of course, but he has done a lot of work for us and actually found a facebook group for this company and seen that they have been trading for some time etc.

Thanks Lars, that's much appreciated.

Rgds
Matt

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

That said, I have had some sobering conversations with 'that guy' tonight and he has reminded me of the commonality of Bilstein dampers failing, which to be fair does seem to be quite regular. I believe you had 1 or 2 replaced yourself if I remember correctly?

Good point Matt, and well remembered.

Yes I did have one failure, however in fairness Bilstein were fantastic in replacing both front dampers without batting an eyelid, and they were only too well aware of the problem, and were adamant that the problem had been resolved.

It goes without saying that the above should never have happened, but shit does.

Would I buy Bilstein again?
Without a doubt, and at the price above even more so.

It's worth bearing in mind that the other options mentioned are the Birds kit, this kit uses component parts from the same source, and is £300.00 odd more expensive, OK it has an arguably softer ride........apparently?

The other option is the Ohlins kit, I've read reviews that wax lyrical about how good it is, however at three times the price (of this kit) it's a big, big buy, and unless you spend a lot of time tracking the car it's arguable as to whether you'll ever see your monies worth on roads here that are bettered by some third world countries!

My car certainly handled well on track with Billies





PS - Lars rocks

[RagingKileak]

Believe it or not this is actually closer to HALF the price of the Birds kit - which is £1200+ at the moment.

Ohlins is around £1700 and KW V3 about £1400.

So yeah, this is definitely a very strong value proposition!

Matt