E90Post
 


TNT Racewerks
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > OE Tuning vs. Active Autowerks ECU Tune



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      11-11-2010, 09:02 AM   #1
335imax
Private First Class
24
Rep
198
Posts

Drives: 2008 335i
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Virginia

iTrader: (1)

OE Tuning vs. Active Autowerks ECU Tune

Like to hear some opinions on these two tunes. It looks like OE Tuning has Active Autowerks beat on the Dyno, but is this tune safe? What are you running and for how long...

OE Tuning
http://www.youtube.com/user/OEtuning...13/Ufz3uM8cl3k
__________________
335i Sport, Koni Adjustable, Cobb Accessport, VRSF FMIC, M3 Control Arms
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 09:13 AM   #2
Omar@ActiveAutowerke
Lieutenant Colonel
136
Rep
1,783
Posts

Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Miami

iTrader: (1)

My opinion is obviously bias but I would like to chime in none the less. Our tune/dyno reflects real world gains done on our in house dyno. On a NA BMW there is very little HP/TQ left on the table and we feel we extract that power the most reliable way possible.

Best,
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 10:54 AM   #3
Gavin@MMW
Brigadier General
Gavin@MMW's Avatar
United_States
295
Rep
3,879
Posts

Drives: MMW Supercharged E90 328i
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: 818/805

iTrader: (18)

Been running it since 5-1-10 and the car pulls all day long.

Im all for a friendly comparison, here is a dyno of a z4si (same N52 as a 330) done on a Dyno Dynamics dyno, so its a real world number and not inflated like a dynojet.

z4 3.0si


We do a full Valvetronic tune, which is different then just adding more fuel and a sharper throttle like a PBX or others do.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 11:01 AM   #4
robbiec
Private
1
Rep
69
Posts

Drives: 2006 325i
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

This has the potential to be an awesome discussion! Would love to hear from both tuners exactly what parameters they can tweak, such as Air/Fuel, Ignition Timing, Valve Lift, Valve Overlap, Throttle Mapping. Would also love to hear what is different in the programming between 330 vs 328 vs 325. We know the displacement, bore, stroke, heads, cams, and compression ratio are all the same for all three N52 cars. What is different inside the ECU?!

Never saw that Youtube video before. That is a nice dyno graph for a stock 328. Can a 325 see the same peak numbers? If not, why?
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 11:07 AM   #5
Dark_Knight_335
Came to the N55 Darkside
Dark_Knight_335's Avatar
United_States
991
Rep
12,741
Posts

Drives: 2011 335 E93 M-Sport
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NY/NJ

iTrader: (28)

I don't know if the tune is safe for the engine longterm. Seems far too invasive regarding the Valvetronic etc. Good luck and hopefully your engine doesn't blow down the road. I'm not sold, especially with the prospect of pulling my own ECU and shipping it across the country. That's a dealbreaker.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 12:07 PM   #6
AlpineSwift
Colonel
AlpineSwift's Avatar
United_States
52
Rep
2,114
Posts

Drives: 2008 335Xi Coupé
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Castle Rock, CO

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDeFranco1 View Post
I don't know if the tune is safe for the engine longterm. Seems far too invasive regarding the Valvetronic etc. Good luck and hopefully your engine doesn't blow down the road. I'm not sold, especially with the prospect of pulling my own ECU and shipping it across the country. That's a dealbreaker.
Sometimes you gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette.
__________________
E92 '08 335Xi 6AT - Cobb AP3 Tuned by MAC Autosport, Original Prototype Xi DOCRace 6266 Single Turbo Swap, VRSF CP w/Synapse BOV, VRSF 7" FMIC, BMS Cowl, H&R Coilovers, Renn Motorsport RS-51's, Stoptech Stage 2 Slotted, xHP Stage 3, Earl's Racing Oil Cooler, Turner Boost Gauge, M3 Lip Spoiler.
Standing Mile Record Holder for Xi over a mile high: 168.2MPH @ 5512'; The Colorado Mile hosted by The US Mile.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 12:08 PM   #7
allmotorh22
making his own parts.
28
Rep
142
Posts

Drives: Naturally Aspirated
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: los angeles

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDeFranco1 View Post
I don't know if the tune is safe for the engine longterm. Seems far too invasive regarding the Valvetronic etc. Good luck and hopefully your engine doesn't blow down the road. I'm not sold, especially with the prospect of pulling my own ECU and shipping it across the country. That's a dealbreaker.
I think it would only be an unsafe tune if they disregarded (or don't know) if the engine was detonating at high rpm. (do they use a egt when tuning btw?)
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 12:16 PM   #8
Dark_Knight_335
Came to the N55 Darkside
Dark_Knight_335's Avatar
United_States
991
Rep
12,741
Posts

Drives: 2011 335 E93 M-Sport
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NY/NJ

iTrader: (28)

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpineSwift View Post
Sometimes you gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette.


I'm not made of money though, A BMW engine rebuild isn't on my list of mods
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 12:18 PM   #9
Dark_Knight_335
Came to the N55 Darkside
Dark_Knight_335's Avatar
United_States
991
Rep
12,741
Posts

Drives: 2011 335 E93 M-Sport
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NY/NJ

iTrader: (28)

Quote:
Originally Posted by allmotorh22 View Post
I think it would only be an unsafe tune if they disregarded (or don't know) if the engine was detonating at high rpm. (do they use a egt when tuning btw?)
You are most likely correct, but still, pulling my ECU and shipping it isn't in the cards. Anyone wanna invest in a flashing station and a GB for this?
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 12:19 PM   #10
mike-y
just another bmw douche bag
United_States
165
Rep
3,670
Posts

Drives: 1.9L of fury
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA

iTrader: (4)

There are things far worse for your engine than one of these tunes. If Air/Fuel ratios are kept in check, there will be no harm done to the motor. Extreme valvetronic tuning could bring up issues with valve float, but what we are seeing on that front is very mild at best. I'd say most of those gains from OE are from tuning the AFR anyway.

Either way, both options will give you a decent gain in power. Honestly, they are very close to each other, and I'd just get whichever one is more convenient for you.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 02:44 PM   #11
Gavin@MMW
Brigadier General
Gavin@MMW's Avatar
United_States
295
Rep
3,879
Posts

Drives: MMW Supercharged E90 328i
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: 818/805

iTrader: (18)

Quote:
Originally Posted by robbiec View Post
This has the potential to be an awesome discussion! Would love to hear from both tuners exactly what parameters they can tweak, such as Air/Fuel, Ignition Timing, Valve Lift, Valve Overlap, Throttle Mapping. Would also love to hear what is different in the programming between 330 vs 328 vs 325. We know the displacement, bore, stroke, heads, cams, and compression ratio are all the same for all three N52 cars. What is different inside the ECU?!

Never saw that Youtube video before. That is a nice dyno graph for a stock 328. Can a 325 see the same peak numbers? If not, why?
Some of the things we change are:

AFR's
Throttle response
Valve Lift/Drop for Intake/exhaust
and Timing

Timing is where most power is to be had, and We have played with some VERY aggressive timing curves on my personal car - and there is room for more power - but the car is running on the ragged edge at that point and is 100 octane dependent.

You guys need to remember these cars are able to run as low as 87 octane gas, so from the dealer it has to be able to adjust timing for low octane and bad air. The everyday person doesn't care about what gas they use, and are not in to tuning.

For the enthusiast such as ourselves, we use 91 at least, all the time. Or anything higher we can get our hands on - so when we tune, we tune to have 91 as the lowest octane rating - allowing us to run much more aggressive timing and enable the car to rev and pull all the way to redline.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 03:19 PM   #12
Scottycs
BMW OG
United_States
23
Rep
557
Posts

Drives: 09 335i
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Charlotte, NC

iTrader: (6)

I am interested, but the lack of information is kind of disappointing. The one dyno for the z4 is nice, but how about on a 325i or a 328i? I think everyone is waiting to see dynos from the public vs. the car the software was tuned for. With software the gains will change from car to car. It would be nice to see a few dynos before and after install, but most people are unwilling to spend the money to do that.
__________________
-Chris
2009 335i 6MT
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 03:33 PM   #13
Viral@ActiveAutowerke
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
Viral@ActiveAutowerke's Avatar
United_States
79
Rep
502
Posts


Drives: 1 of a kind ;)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Miami, Florida

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 135i  [5.00]
Send a message via AIM to Viral@ActiveAutowerke
Exclamation

Our Performance Software also takes the vehicles Valvetronic into accountability in our Performance Tune. There is only a certain limit which these N/A N52 can be tuned to obtain the maximum power without compromising the safety of the motor. Our Goal with our Performance Software is to Increase the vehicle's Performance but to maintain driveablity and reliability under all climate and altitude conditions. Also our Performance Software provides a much smoother increase of power especially in mid-range and throughout the entire RPM Band, as you can see below on a recent installation of our Performance Software on a 328i on a 95 Degrees Fahrenheit day in Miami on a Mustang Dyno. As being one of the longest reputable Premier BMW Performance Tuners in the BMW Industry our Software Engineering Department has developed Performance Tunes from the E30 325's to the Current X6M's.


Vehicle: 2009 328i
Transmission: Automatic
Mileage: 15,XXX
Modifications: Muffler Delete & Active Autowerke Performance Software 93 Octane

Climate Conditions: 95 Degrees Fahrenheit
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 03:41 PM   #14
Scottycs
BMW OG
United_States
23
Rep
557
Posts

Drives: 09 335i
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Charlotte, NC

iTrader: (6)

Looks like AA has similar results with a better price at $399.
__________________
-Chris
2009 335i 6MT
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 03:51 PM   #15
Gavin@MMW
Brigadier General
Gavin@MMW's Avatar
United_States
295
Rep
3,879
Posts

Drives: MMW Supercharged E90 328i
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: 818/805

iTrader: (18)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottycs View Post
Looks like AA has similar results with a better price at $399.
Lol if a dollar is going to break you
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 03:59 PM   #16
Scottycs
BMW OG
United_States
23
Rep
557
Posts

Drives: 09 335i
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Charlotte, NC

iTrader: (6)

The software is listed at $590 on OE's site vs $399 for AA. Thats $191 unless I am missing something.
__________________
-Chris
2009 335i 6MT
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 04:01 PM   #17
Gavin@MMW
Brigadier General
Gavin@MMW's Avatar
United_States
295
Rep
3,879
Posts

Drives: MMW Supercharged E90 328i
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: 818/805

iTrader: (18)

Check the vendor section, e90post gets very nice deals from me
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 04:43 PM   #18
Viral@ActiveAutowerke
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
Viral@ActiveAutowerke's Avatar
United_States
79
Rep
502
Posts


Drives: 1 of a kind ;)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Miami, Florida

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 135i  [5.00]
Send a message via AIM to Viral@ActiveAutowerke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottycs View Post
The software is listed at $590 on OE's site vs $399 for AA. Thats $191 unless I am missing something.
We also have Dealers all across the US & Canada and Internationally can do this Performance Software On-Site.

Active Autowerke Authorized Dealers

Last edited by Viral@ActiveAutowerke; 11-11-2010 at 05:45 PM.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 06:00 PM   #19
allmotorh22
making his own parts.
28
Rep
142
Posts

Drives: Naturally Aspirated
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: los angeles

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craven 328 View Post
Check the vendor section, e90post gets very nice deals from me
Sweet, I'm local. I could use use your business. but Active brings up a good point. will there be issues w/ altitude (lets say driving up to Big Bear)?

(would it be custom tuning if I add a larger throttle body?)
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 06:10 PM   #20
Gavin@MMW
Brigadier General
Gavin@MMW's Avatar
United_States
295
Rep
3,879
Posts

Drives: MMW Supercharged E90 328i
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: 818/805

iTrader: (18)

Here is a Dyno of a bone stock 328 we did:

Last edited by Gavin@MMW; 11-11-2010 at 10:41 PM.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 07:40 PM   #21
dtc100
Lieutenant Colonel
21
Rep
1,523
Posts

Drives: 2011 E90 328i 6AT non-sport
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norcal

iTrader: (0)

Thank you both for providing good info and healthy competition, you guys are both above the board awesome, I don't think we can go wrong with either one of you. Other than the tuning location, what are your policies as far as if the dealer reset the software, what kind of coverage you guys can provide?

I noticed the AA dyno was on 93 octane. Here in CA I can only reasonably find 91 octane gas. Everything being equal, the OE tune does seem more aggressive.
Appreciate 0
      11-11-2010, 07:49 PM   #22
dtc100
Lieutenant Colonel
21
Rep
1,523
Posts

Drives: 2011 E90 328i 6AT non-sport
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norcal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craven 328 View Post
Here is a Dyno of a bone stock 328 we did:
It is not showing up on my browser.
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:52 PM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST