[mob17]

Originally Posted by Mark M

Please explain the difference, PWM-V vs PPS??

If you see this page: http://procedetuning.com/BMW/n54/methanol/methanol.html
Scrolling down you'll see a section highlighted in yellow.

Greekboy: Yes they are a little more pricey. But if you see here it gives you price and feature comparisons: http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/compare-4.gif

The website also has a forum with loads of info (far more technical for my knowledge!)

[GreekboyD]

Just saw that mob17. I also realized that the UK buys it from Howerton Engineering who are based out of California. Much cheaper price that way as the middle man is cut out and cheaper shipping. Here is a direct link to Howerton Engineering:

Link

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION
The Aquamist HFS-4 is now at revision 3. Revision 3 added new auxiliary failsafe inputs to the system, including a wideband input as well as IAT input. The HFS-4 is suited for Direct Injection applications with its multiple inputs to properly map the engines load in Direct Injected cars. These inputs include the fuel injectors, the MAP sensor, and the high pressure fuel rail signal.

Of course the HFS-4 uses a constant pressure PWM valve injection for prescise metering of the injected fluid into the intake track. This ensures precise injection in relation to load ensuring crisp response across partial and full throttle loads and no over run on throttle lifting.

Kit comes complete with everything needed except for a tank.

JETTING: The system comes with three jets sizes .8mm, .9mm and 1.0mm as standard. You can pick any three sizes from the drop down menu. There is a link to calculating your jetting below.

.3mm jets maybe substituted for an additional charge.

Choosing NONE for the second jet option also deletes the tee and jet adapter along with the second jet. You will only be able to install 1 jet in your setup if you delete the second jet from the options.

Choosing NONE for the third jet option only deletes the third jet.

Jetting Calculating jet sizing for Aquamist systems is quite easy as we will walk you through a few simple steps, then some examples. At the bottom of the page you will find some conversion factors if you are using other jets and systems.

Example 1

1) First, you will need three pieces of information. Fuel injector size, number of cylinders(hopefully this one comes easy) and peak boost pressure.

2) Take the number of cylinders and multiply by the injector size. For example, let’s use a 4 cylinder with 800cc injectors. This car would have a total of 3200cc of injectors.

There is a general rule of thumb for injection. Three guidelines are below:

For 100% water target 10% – 15% of fuel flow
For 50/50 mix target 15% – 20% of fuel flow
For 100% methanol target 20% – -25% of fuel flow

For this example we will use a 50/50 mix. So find the range of jetting you need by the following:

3) Multiply your total fuel injector number from step 2 by 15% and 20%.

3200cc x 15% = 480cc
3200cc x 20% = 640cc

4) Subtract your peak boost pressure from the system running pressure on the chart and find the appropriate jetting range.



For the example being discussed we want to target 20% which would be 640cc. We also know our peak boost is 30psi. The new Aquatec pumps run at 165psi, the older Shurflo pumps at 125psi. We have a brand new HFS-4 installed in our test car so we use the 165psi starting point.

4) We start at the 165psi line, and subtract our 30psi boost pressure. This means we need to look at a phantom line of 135psi. So we have our 640cc target, we look down the columns and estimate that between the 130 and 140 columns 640cc is going to fall around…….wait, it’s off the chart. We need to use two jets. So, we split the 640cc in half and see that 320cc falls between the 130 and 140 columns right right between the .7mm and .8mm jet range. In this instance we will pick two .8mm jet as we can always trim the flow down with the gain functions.

Now, the hardest part is finding a spot for two injectors in the intake system.

IMPORTANT NOTE

It is best to test your jetting into a container and measure the flow. Since every build and configuration is different this will be your best measure of the system performance.

Example 2:

6 cylinder, 1000cc injectors, 35psi boost and we will run 100% methanol.

6 x 1000cc = 6000cc.
6000cc x .25 = 1500cc
1500 / 3 = 500cc for each jet.

Now we are getting close to the edge because the HFS series systems max out at about 1500cc of flow. Since we are calculating right at the limit we should be fine. NOTE: FAV’s post 9/2012 flow 1500cc, pre-9/2012 FAV’s rated at 1300cc)

From the chart we can see we will need 3 jets to get the job done. So we look down the 130psi line (165-35 peak boost = 130) and find the 500cc for each jet falls just above the 1.0mm jetting. In this case we would probably pair 2 x 1.2mm with 1 x 1.0mm jets to hit the 1500cc target. If running a split plenum that requires 3 equal size jets, 3 x 1.0mm would be recommended. The best test to see your actual flow is to measure the flow into a container through the system.

[Hoooper]

FYI jetting is supposed to be different for diesel engines than gas, so dont size your jet based on a gas sizing chart.

[GreekboyD]

Originally Posted by Hoooper

FYI jetting is supposed to be different for diesel engines than gas, so dont size your jet based on a gas sizing chart.

Good advice.

[Masstar]

Woops, I switched my nozzle to the middle one, I think it's 300ml, and it drank my whole WW reservoir in 3 days, ha ha! Was running 8-25 boot progression. Think I will have to make it come on later... I cant afford that much meth!

[Hoooper]

Originally Posted by Masstar

Woops, I switched my nozzle to the middle one, I think it's 300ml, and it drank my whole WW reservoir in 3 days, ha ha! Was running 8-25 boot progression. Think I will have to make it come on later... I cant afford that much meth!

woah! you must do a lot of up and down hill driving. Mine usually lasts a month in normal driving, but I have emptied 1.5 gallons in 4 hours driving up a mountain and that was just normal keeping speed. I would hate to see how fast it could go if someone had it run while doing a track day

[gtp900]

So is there a calc for diesel motors?

[Masstar]

Your exactly right, I have to go up and over the hill each day for work. I think I must have done some great cleaning though. I think I will turn it down to 10-25 and see how that goes. As a side note, my mileage has gone way up, at least 5 mpg.

Originally Posted by Hoooper

woah! you must do a lot of up and down hill driving. Mine usually lasts a month in normal driving, but I have emptied 1.5 gallons in 4 hours driving up a mountain and that was just normal keeping speed. I would hate to see how fast it could go if someone had it run while doing a track day

[Vreimann]

Originally Posted by Masstar

Woops, I switched my nozzle to the middle one, I think it's 300ml, and it drank my whole WW reservoir in 3 days, ha ha! Was running 8-25 boot progression. Think I will have to make it come on later... I cant afford that much meth!

You need access to our washer fluid. I think its about 3-4$ gallon sells everywhere in bulk.

[Masstar]

Do you have a dealer in Hawaii? Most fluid out here is the +35 degree stuff which I'm told is no good. Pure meth here is very expensive.

Originally Posted by Vreimann

You need access to our washer fluid. I think its about 3-4$ gallon sells everywhere in bulk.

[Hoooper]

Did you find a race shop? The place I buy from is around $4/gal for 100% methanol

[Masstar]

Yes I did but you wont believe me when I tell you...$90 for 5 gallons.

Originally Posted by Hoooper

Did you find a race shop? The place I buy from is around $4/gal for 100% methanol

[GreekboyD]

Originally Posted by mob17

If you see this page: http://procedetuning.com/BMW/n54/methanol/methanol.html
Scrolling down you'll see a section highlighted in yellow.

Greekboy: Yes they are a little more pricey. But if you see here it gives you price and feature comparisons: http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/compare-4.gif

The website also has a forum with loads of info (far more technical for my knowledge!)

Jeff from Howerton Engineering told me it takes roughly 8-10 hours to install their Aquamist HFS-4 Injection System.

[Mark M]

Curious why BMW NA did not develop a water/meth repair tool for the 35d instead of walnut blasting? (Assuming water/meth really is a good cleaning agent)

I'd imagine the dealer could install a removable water/meth kit, allow the customer to drive with it for ~500 miles (or whatever is deemed appropriate interval) and then dealer removes and sends happy customer on their way.

We know BMW NA engineers must have spent significant time developing the SIB for cleaning. I have to wonder why they may not have went this route?

[GreekboyD]

I'd figure because of liability issues. Imagine people doing the meth dealer approach and then getting SES codes a few days later.

[TDIwyse]

Well, they'd have to re-certify the car with the EPA to allow it to be road legal with the water/methanol. That's a long, expensive process...

[Mark M]

Originally Posted by TDIwyse

Well, they'd have to re-certify the car with the EPA to allow it to be road legal with the water/methanol. That's a long, expensive process...

This could be a valid point. Although I wonder if it was intended as a short term use repair tool would it gain an exemption.

[Hoooper]

Originally Posted by Mark M

This could be a valid point. Although I wonder if it was intended as a short term use repair tool would it gain an exemption.

mine wasnt completely clean in over 10k miles including probably over 5k miles with the EGR blocked. I doubt the EPA would consider a year long installation to be short term. Meth is a good long term remediation and prevention method, its certainly not a short term solution if you have bad buildup

[stevers314]

I have a 2000mi trip this weekend, all highway of course. Should I just run straight water or mix in some methanol? 4 gallons of boost juice should be on my doorstep shortly but I don't really want to burn though that just cruising if water alone will provide the same cleaning benefit.

[gtp900]

Originally Posted by stevers314

I have a 2000mi trip this weekend, all highway of course. Should I just run straight water or mix in some methanol? 4 gallons of boost juice should be on my doorstep shortly but I don't really want to burn though that just cruising if water alone will provide the same cleaning benefit.

Water alone will not help intake manifold, but will help valves and head, so it depends on what you are trying to clean

[stevers314]

Well, update on my install and how the trip went. First let me say that I am an idiot.

I was averaging about 150mi/gal of washer fluid. It seemed excessive because i really wasn't romping on it much. About 750 mi in and after I topped off my last jug I started getting a ton of false laser alerts through my jammer - figured it was just some crap NY put on I90 since my last trip. As it turns out, whenever the 1st stage was injecting, the jammer would give me an alert for a specific speed camera. My laser jammer wires are going through the same grommet I used for the solenoids, I suspect the interference is what's causing that so I'm moving those wires over to the DDE compartment this weekend.

Second thing, the consumption just seemed like way too much. I only have the 60cc nozzle in for stage 1 and a 225cc for stage two. I had a revelation as to what was going on. Since the kit was installed last weekend I always heard a buzz right as stage 1 would begin progressing, I figured it was just the pump running at a slow speed as the sound went away. Turns out that buzz was the relay I put in. I hooked a relay up to the circuit to activate the pump so I could draw power right from the battery. Once the relay got enough voltage to stop buzzing the pump was basically at full output (~14psi). Going back through for a rewire later today or tomorrow. this time i will feed the 20a circuit to the controller and then tie the white wire to the pump as it should have been.

I suspect the quench I saw was due to the pump coming on strong at a lower boost level. Also if it was turning on and off quick from the relay, I could see how that would create a sloppy spray pattern.

Yep, a dumbass.

edit: also of note, I managed to trigger the other "mode" TDIwyse discovered with the EGR valve. I only did it once, but left it that way for a 300mi stretch of the trip.

[stevers314]

Relocating the wires didn't help with the laser jammer, but at least now i have zero quench progressing the 60cc nozzle from 11-19psi.