Solid Subframe Bushings: HATE them!

Tambohamilton · 03-23-2023, 03:49 AM

Ok, I'll say it: There's no way the bushings are causing the noise [to be transmitted into the cab]. Extra roar (normal road noise)? Sure. Extra feedback on impacts? Sure. More gear whine? Sure. Crazy loud buzz/drone? No. That buzz shouldn't exist. Something else is wrong.

tylerhart_21 · 03-23-2023, 01:55 PM

Don’t sure if a phone can pick up the sound frequency changes. Does it change in frequency at all or stay the same?

feuer · 03-23-2023, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tambohamilton

Ok, I'll say it: There's no way the bushings are causing the noise [to be transmitted into the cab]. Extra roar (normal road noise)? Sure. Extra feedback on impacts? Sure. More gear whine? Sure. Crazy loud buzz/drone? No. That buzz shouldn't exist. Something else is wrong.

Some time it happens like that. I had race solid engine mounts that I really like but did not like the car so I sold the car, kept the mounts and installed them on a another car, newer even, and that car absolutely hated the mounts, I did too, so I removed one, then later on the other too, it was horrible. It's a combination of things, and could be anywhere from perfect harmony to absolute disaster. Also, sometimes parts fail and the failure coincidently occurs at the same time with the work performed, or failure is just being accelerated or amplified be the work or other parts installed. Too many variables. Bad install is a possibility too. But agree with you, that's little too much to be only from solid subframe bushings.

feuer · 03-23-2023, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cruizinmax

I felt like these bushing helped reduce the "squirm" by 20% or so. The

Interesting how you just nonchalantly claim 20%

Tambohamilton · 03-23-2023, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feuer

Interesting how you just nonchalantly claim 20%

No more than 19.7%, and that's a fact. You can't deny it.

cruizinmax · 03-25-2023, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whyzee125

I'll definitely get under there again and check that. Weird how it changed with the tires but I've seen a lot of weird things on these cars lol

When you're doing this test, you'll need to make sure you're loading the drivetrain stimulating the load of driving. Perhaps riding the brakes or using the parking brake. Also make sure the control arms are at a similar angle to ride height. Like putting the lower control arms on jackstands.

I thought I recall reading you had a mfactory diff the had the bolts backed out. It wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that when that happened some damage happened to the diff bearings or ring and pinion.

whyzee125 · 03-26-2023, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cruizinmax

When you're doing this test, you'll need to make sure you're loading the drivetrain stimulating the load of driving. Perhaps riding the brakes or using the parking brake. Also make sure the control arms are at a similar angle to ride height. Like putting the lower control arms on jackstands.

I thought I recall reading you had a mfactory diff the had the bolts backed out. It wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that when that happened some damage happened to the diff bearings or ring and pinion.

Thanks! I'll try putting some load on the suspension and engine and try again. My whole diff unit actually exploded so everything is fresh though it's recently come to my attention that Mfactory doesn't replace bearings or anything when they build these so it could be that I got a "new" diff with bearings that have a ton of miles/wear on them and they're a bit noisy? It honestly sounded fine under the car but I'll check when under load. Thank you!

jzx_andy · 04-10-2023, 08:17 AM

Any luck OP?

whyzee125 · 04-10-2023, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jzx_andy

Any luck OP?

Unfortunately life's been in the way and I haven't gotten to mess with the car at all, but hoping to in the next few weeks. Can't wait to get her sounding right again, however that needs to be done lol

whyzee125 · 04-21-2023, 06:23 PM

Update:

Dug a little deeper underneath the car and it seems I likely have a bad left wheel bearing. The sound doesn't change when turning either direction and there is no play in the wheel but it sure is gritty and noticeably louder than the other side when spinning by hand.

Tambohamilton · 04-21-2023, 08:18 PM

Fingers crossed!

Andy198712 · 04-26-2023, 03:06 PM

Deffo not the handbrake pads?

whyzee125 · 04-26-2023, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy198712

Deffo not the handbrake pads?

I don't think so, handbrake feels normal and the wheels aren't hard to turn by hand, but one isn't smooth--it feels super gritty.

gunnerxq · 04-28-2023, 12:09 AM

Yeah probably wheel bearings. My rear passenger wheel bearing went bad fast amd was creating a resonating sound in the cabin like you describe

Snertz · 05-04-2023, 10:58 AM

Possible the CSB was installed upside down when the shop replaced it?

It's a pretty easy mistake to make, see here: https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1865464

whyzee125 · 05-04-2023, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snertz

Possible the CSB was installed upside down when the shop replaced it?

It's a pretty easy mistake to make, see here: https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1865464

It's possible but so far these guys don't miss, it's really a quality shop. I think it's my left rear wheel bearing. One reply a few posts back was shocked that it was quiet underneath with the car running so I promised I'd take another look.

It is quiet but when I turn it by hand, it's super gritty and without any engine noise (car off in neutral) I can spin it just fast enough to get some roar. The right side is dead silent. So I think that's my issue.

I just have had absolutely zero time to mess with it as I'm building a house and have a few other projects that I need to finish so I'm just driving my 4runner most days.

andreu12qw · 05-04-2023, 10:50 PM

Keep us posted OP!

Torgus · 05-22-2023, 04:57 PM

Any news?

whyzee125 · 05-22-2023, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torgus

Any news?

Sadly no, the only shop I trust is over an hour away and with building a house and a little routine maintenance on the car that I DIY'd I just haven't had time to take it in. Hopefully this next week!

whyzee125 · 06-27-2023, 11:14 PM

It was the left rear wheel bearing! Got it replaced today and I literally cannot believe how quiet the car is inside. I'm a VERY happy camper and can now confirm the subframe bushings, in my experience, add very little NVH, with zero of that being noise. Thanks to all who suggested a bearing issue, you were in fact correct!

Tambohamilton · 06-28-2023, 07:52 AM

Awesome. Glad you got it sorted!

Torgus · 06-28-2023, 08:53 AM

Excellent! Everyone should have solid subframe bushings.

03-23-2023, 03:49 AM	#67
Tambohamilton Brigadier General 3058 Rep 3,909 Posts Drives: E91 330d Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: Herefordshire iTrader: (0)	Ok, I'll say it: There's no way the bushings are causing the noise [to be transmitted into the cab]. Extra roar (normal road noise)? Sure. Extra feedback on impacts? Sure. More gear whine? Sure. Crazy loud buzz/drone? No. That buzz shouldn't exist. Something else is wrong.
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03-23-2023, 01:55 PM	#68
tylerhart_21 Private First Class 34 Rep 181 Posts Drives: 2008 Bmw 328i Coupe Join Date: Feb 2020 Location: North Carolina iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 Bmw 328i [0.00]	Don’t sure if a phone can pick up the sound frequency changes. Does it change in frequency at all or stay the same?
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04-10-2023, 08:17 AM	#74
jzx_andy Slowpoke 245 Rep 291 Posts Drives: 2008 E92 335i N54 Join Date: Jul 2018 Location: Perth, Australia iTrader: (0)	Any luck OP? __________________ build thread - OEM+ WIDEBODY \| Factory Individual Audio, Active Steering, Comfort Access & M-Sport optioned 6MT swapped \| Xtreme twin disk & SMF \| Advan RSII \| ST XTA \| F82 M4 heated front seats \| BMW Individual interior trims \| CIC/Combox retrofits \| Custom headlights \| 1M/M3 mirrors \| 335is auxiliary radiator \| LCI tails
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04-21-2023, 06:23 PM	#76
whyzee125 Brigadier General 1665 Rep 3,629 Posts Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Chattanooga Tn iTrader: (0)	Update: Dug a little deeper underneath the car and it seems I likely have a bad left wheel bearing. The sound doesn't change when turning either direction and there is no play in the wheel but it sure is gritty and noticeably louder than the other side when spinning by hand.
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04-21-2023, 08:18 PM	#77
Tambohamilton Brigadier General 3058 Rep 3,909 Posts Drives: E91 330d Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: Herefordshire iTrader: (0)	Fingers crossed!
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04-26-2023, 03:06 PM	#78
Andy198712 Major 145 Rep 1,007 Posts Drives: 2010 E91 325d Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Cornwall iTrader: (0)	Deffo not the handbrake pads?
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04-28-2023, 12:09 AM	#80
gunnerxq Lieutenant Colonel 213 Rep 1,780 Posts Drives: e90 "325i" Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: New York iTrader: (1)	Yeah probably wheel bearings. My rear passenger wheel bearing went bad fast amd was creating a resonating sound in the cabin like you describe __________________ Koni special active red, eibach pro-kit springs, Remus exhaust, stage 3 intake manifold,Stage 2 AA tune, BMW Short shift kit. Silicon intake pipe. M3 control arms front, M3 rear. ECS trailing arm with whiteline bushings. Purple powerflex subframe bushings. Yellow power flex upper shock mounts. Single mass flywheel OE weight.
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05-04-2023, 10:58 AM	#81
Snertz H O O N 86 Rep 694 Posts Drives: ein M! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: NY iTrader: (9)	Possible the CSB was installed upside down when the shop replaced it? It's a pretty easy mistake to make, see here: https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1865464 __________________ U WOT M8?
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05-04-2023, 10:50 PM	#83
andreu12qw Second Lieutenant 53 Rep 212 Posts Drives: '11 E90 335i MSport Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: SoCal iTrader: (2)	Keep us posted OP!
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05-22-2023, 04:57 PM	#84
Torgus Slow. 3782 Rep 7,151 Posts Drives: Single Turbo N54 on Meth! Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW E92 [10.00] 2007 BMW E90 [0.00] 2006 BMW E91 [0.00]	Any news? __________________ E92 ACF ST 6466 + Meth Motiv / E70 #1 fully deleted 2.8 race flash / E70 #2 JBD / E90 & E91 both retired Psalm 144
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06-27-2023, 11:14 PM	#86
whyzee125 Brigadier General 1665 Rep 3,629 Posts Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Chattanooga Tn iTrader: (0)	It was the left rear wheel bearing! Got it replaced today and I literally cannot believe how quiet the car is inside. I'm a VERY happy camper and can now confirm the subframe bushings, in my experience, add very little NVH, with zero of that being noise. Thanks to all who suggested a bearing issue, you were in fact correct! Last edited by whyzee125; 06-28-2023 at 11:36 AM..
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06-28-2023, 07:52 AM	#87
Tambohamilton Brigadier General 3058 Rep 3,909 Posts Drives: E91 330d Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: Herefordshire iTrader: (0)	Awesome. Glad you got it sorted!
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06-28-2023, 08:53 AM	#88
Torgus Slow. 3782 Rep 7,151 Posts Drives: Single Turbo N54 on Meth! Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW E92 [10.00] 2007 BMW E90 [0.00] 2006 BMW E91 [0.00]	Excellent! Everyone should have solid subframe bushings. __________________ E92 ACF ST 6466 + Meth Motiv / E70 #1 fully deleted 2.8 race flash / E70 #2 JBD / E90 & E91 both retired Psalm 144
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