[TheMidnightNarwhal]

I'm trying to understand why the Redline MTL 75W80 is recommended for manual transmission fluid but no where I read it's listed to meet the BMW MTF LT-3 spec, which is what my transmission needs.

I'm considering getting the Febi FEB-40580 instead for this very reason as theirs is clearly listed to meet BMW MTF LT-3 spec.

Can anyone shed some light on this?

UPDATE: Ok guys I have the whole picture about it now from ZF.

ZF told me for MTF LT 3 the BMW part number they have on file is 23007533818. Googling this I get results for actual manual transmission fluids that are 75w80 with BMW MTF LT 3 spec. The OE seems to be Fuchs also but not 100% sure on that.

Now the new part no. in Realoem is different from this one, it is 83222339221 and that is also manual transmission fluid but it is 75w90 for some reason. All I can find is genuine BMW, the others are the same as for the first part no 23007533818.

Now when I called my dealer for some manual fluid, they provided part number 83222156969 which seems to be the new MTF LT 5 spec which I guess incorporates LT 3 to. The thing with that fluid is it appears to be indeed some ATF and Febi seems to be the OE. So I guess that's also why Redline recommends ATF.

So now, all that being said, I will probably stick with what was in it originally and should be fine for winter. I will go for the 75W80 mtf lt 3 spec made by Febi that I originally linked.

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

I dunno. A lot of people use it and it works great. I used Redline D4. It felt exactly like the stock fluid.

MTF-LT-3 spec basically calls for ATF. Not sure why.
MTF-LT-5 spec calls for DSG fluid. Also not sure why.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

I dunno. A lot of people use it and it works great. I used Redline D4. It felt exactly like the stock fluid.

MTF-LT-3 spec basically calls for ATF. Not sure why.
MTF-LT-5 spec calls for DSG fluid. Also not sure why.

Yeah I noticed that to! In BMW TIS it said fill with ATF I thought it was just confusing with another transmission.

I would really like genuine fluid to save headaches but at 40$ for 1 liter and I need 2... it's like a B to buy that.

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

Yeah I noticed that to! In BMW TIS it said fill with ATF I thought it was just confusing with another transmission.

I would really like genuine fluid to save headaches but at 40$ for 1 liter and I need 2... it's like to much.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. I've never heard of someone ruining their gearbox because they used their favorite brand of manual transmission fluid. The main things you'll want to look for are cold shifting behavior, notchiness, and assurance that the fluid weight meets the gearbox specifications (which basically they all will).

For example, I once used Royal Purple Synchromax. When it got extremely cold, like below 0, I didn't like how difficult it was to shift from 1st to 2nd, so I swapped it for Redline D4. It made a big difference in my case.

[Bamaben]

I read a lot about MTL VS D4 ATF for e36, I run D4, but I'd run factory fluid in my non track car

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

I wouldn't worry too much about it. I've never heard of someone ruining their gearbox because they used their favorite brand of manual transmission fluid. The main things you'll want to look for are cold shifting behavior, notchiness, and assurance that the fluid weight meets the gearbox specifications (which basically they all will).

For example, I once used Royal Purple Synchromax. When it got extremely cold, like below 0, I didn't like how difficult it was to shift from 1st to 2nd, so I swapped it for Redline D4. It made a big difference in my case.

Yeah I would need something that is good for winter because I live in Ottawa where it can get below -30c (-22f).

Uhhgg I guess I'll go with that then. I read tho D4 is less viscous on the forum and it could put increased wear but that's on the forums which I read.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Bamaben

I read a lot about MTL VS D4 ATF for e36, I run D4, but I'd run factory fluid in my non track car

But what IS the factory fluid?

Does anyone know what it actually is?

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Redline replied to me and they said to use D6ATF now..

[Drifter2090]

MTL and D4 both worked for me

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal

But what IS the factory fluid?

Does anyone know what it actually is?

MTF-LT-2: Pentosin FFL-4
MTF-LT-3: ???
MTF-LT-4: ???
MTF-LT-5: Pentosin FFL-3

I never found any information about who specifically makes LT-3 or 4, other than they're GL-3/4 75w90 gear oils.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

MTF-LT-2: Pentosin FFL-4
MTF-LT-3: ???
MTF-LT-4: ???
MTF-LT-5: Pentosin FFL-3

I never found any information about who specifically makes LT-3 or 4, other than they're GL-3/4 75w90 gear oils.

Ok so they are GL-4 or 3 type oil. Why would ATF be recommended by Redline then?

I think then Febi might be what I will go for. It's listed as GL-4 and has MTF-LT-3 spec listed. The only thing is viscocity is 80 inatead of 90.

[neilvan]

The BMW fluid for some LT designations is actually an ATF fluid which is why Redline recommends it as the replacement. Its just a lighter fluid and designed to reduce drag (better fuel economy) but at the expense of longevity and wear resistance.

A GL4 70-80 MTF will work but due to the design and tolerances depending on what was spec'ed for your transmission you may not want to in the very very cold. The MTF will always have better shear strength and heat capacity.

With that being said Im in Southern Ontario and run MTL/Redline D4 50/50 split for all year round and MTL for just the summer car. The 50/50 was a tough notchy when the car was cold in -10 or lower temps for the first minute. For me it was well worth the trade off. BTW my trans was spec'ed a LT3 fluid.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

You know what I'm just going to contact ZF I think.

[Bamaben]

The yellow sticker on your trans says which fluid you should run then go online and buy thst

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Bamaben

The yellow sticker on your trans says which fluid you should run then go online and buy thst

Yeah but that says BMW MTF LT-3.

I did some digging. If we look at the Febi bottle for example from FCP euro, it's an actual manual transmission fluid with that spec but then if you look up the OE part number ( 83222156969 ) google shows that it's a Febi automatic transmission fluid.

But I did send an email to ZF yesterday so I'm waiting on that to.

[Bamaben]

I just use the dealer fluid so I know it's exactly the correct fluid rather than worrying about it. Now, with ZF auto transmission like in my X5 it says ZF fluid so I buy that instead of the dealer fluid because it's exactly what the sticker says

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Ok guys I have the whole picture about it now from ZF.

ZF told me for MTF LT 3 the BMW part number they have on file is 23007533818. Googling this I get results for actual manual transmission fluids that are 75w80 with BMW MTF LT 3 spec. The OE seems to be Fuchs also but not 100% sure on that.

Now the new part no. in Realoem is different from this one, it is 83222339221 and that is also manual transmission fluid but it is 75w90 for some reason. All I can find is genuine BMW, the others are the same as for the first part no 23007533818.

Now when I called my dealer for some manual fluid, they provided part number 83222156969 which seems to be the new MTF LT 5 spec which I guess incorporates LT 3 to. The thing with that fluid is it appears to be indeed some ATF and Febi seems to be the OE. So I guess that's also why Redline recommends ATF.

So now, all that being said, I will probably stick with what was in it originally and should be fine for winter. I will go for the 75W80 mtf lt 3 spec made by Febi that I originally linked.

[krhodes1]

Fluid manufacturers generally have to pay licensing fees to use those automaker spec designations. So even if the bottle meets the specs, it may not say so.

As to what it is - for the most part, with transmissions it doesn't matter that much. IN fact, if you look at some of the more generic transmissions that are used across various brands, the recommended fluids can be pretty radically different. And different from what the actual manufacturer recommends.

All of these lubricants are a compromise in one way or another. It is likely that BMW is prioritizing low drag and cold weather shifting over longevity and hot weather shifting. So they use something very much like ATF. A heavier oil like MTL will probably give better actual lubrication and better hot shifting at the expense of fuel economy and cold weather shifting. Pick yer poison.

Personally, when my car was under warranty I used the actual BMW fluid that is priced as though made from virgin unicorn tears. Now that it isn't, and it never gets driven in the winter, it is going to get MTL going forward. Ultimately, I think the more important thing is to actually change it once in a while.

[PhaseP]

Febi is not an oil company, it is a parts supplier, it cannot be the OEM provider. Their bottles must be filled with some other companies oil who is the original manufacturer.

My transmission had MT-LT2 sticker, and I do think it is just because it was a 2006. Later years it became MT-LT3. I have z ZF transmission (XI manuals are all ZF as far as I know)

I had once replaced transmission oil around 60K with Pentosin MT-LT2,not because I had complaints with the shifting but as maintenance due to milage. Transmission felt exactly as it was before with factory fill, so I can believe the claim that Pentosin was the OEM for MT-LT2.

Then a year or more ago I felt 3rd gear was getting somewhat notchy. This time there was no MT-LT2 to available to buy. So I opted for Fuchs Titan Sintofluid SAE 75W80, which on the bottle it gives as recommended oil part numbers that match both MT-LT2 and MT-LT3. When I had replaced with Fuchs, the oil level was somewhat low, which could explain the 3rd gear notchiness. But to my surprise as I drove the car more the gear shifting got better in all gears. After a week it was better shifting then I remembered.
So I recommend Fuchs. It is price is very good too, I had bought mine at RMEuropean.com

Winter shifting is good too. But whatever oil it is, winter time before transmission warms up, which takes a lot longer than engine warming up, gear shifts are always more difficult. Any car owned was like that, regardless of oil. Some oils are better in this than others. The fuchs sintofluid I found to be good in winter, in my experience.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by PhaseP

Febi is not an oil company, it is a parts supplier, it cannot be the OEM provider. Their bottles must be filled with some other companies oil who is the original manufacturer.

My transmission had MT-LT2 sticker, and I do think it is just because it was a 2006. Later years it became MT-LT3. I have z ZF transmission (XI manuals are all ZF as far as I know)

I had once replaced transmission oil around 60K with Pentosin MT-LT2,not because I had complaints with the shifting but as maintenance due to milage. Transmission felt exactly as it was before with factory fill, so I can believe the claim that Pentosin was the OEM for MT-LT2.

Then a year or more ago I felt 3rd gear was getting somewhat notchy. This time there was no MT-LT2 to available to buy. So I opted for Fuchs Titan Sintofluid SAE 75W80, which on the bottle it gives as recommended oil part numbers that match both MT-LT2 and MT-LT3. When I had replaced with Fuchs, the oil level was somewhat low, which could explain the 3rd gear notchiness. But to my surprise as I drove the car more the gear shifting got better in all gears. After a week it was better shifting then I remembered.
So I recommend Fuchs. It is price is very good too, I had bought mine at RMEuropean.com

Winter shifting is good too. But whatever oil it is, winter time before transmission warms up, which takes a lot longer than engine warming up, gear shifts are always more difficult. Any car owned was like that, regardless of oil. Some oils are better in this than others. The fuchs sintofluid I found to be good in winter, in my experience.

Interesting!

Wonder who Febi manufacturer is then...

As for winter shifting, I don't mind how notchy it might be just as long as no extreme increased wear is caused and if OEM has 75w80 I guess that's fine for winter?