[mecheng77]

Originally Posted by rothwem

The ANGER here!

Honestly, though, you sound a lot like the E30 guys when the E36 came out, or the E46 guys when the E90 came out. I really like my E91, like a lot. I can see myself owning this car for a long time.

With that said, my sister in law just got a brand new X5 and its fucking awesome. Its not as fun to drive as my E91, but its easily the best larger SUV I've ever driven. Engine/transmission calibration is fantastic, and they nailed the ride/handling balance--hers even has the normal non-adaptive shocks. Basically, BMW has realized that people don't buy cars anymore, so they've thrown a lot of resources behind making the best crossover/SUV on the market. I'm personally not an SUV guy, but I am impressed at the engineering they've done to make a 5000 pound vehicle handle like something much smaller and lower and still get 26 mpg on the highway.

Originally Posted by rothwem

The ANGER here!

Honestly, though, you sound a lot like the E30 guys when the E36 came out, or the E46 guys when the E90 came out. I really like my E91, like a lot. I can see myself owning this car for a long time.

With that said, my sister in law just got a brand new X5 and its fucking awesome. Its not as fun to drive as my E91, but its easily the best larger SUV I've ever driven. Engine/transmission calibration is fantastic, and they nailed the ride/handling balance--hers even has the normal non-adaptive shocks. Basically, BMW has realized that people don't buy cars anymore, so they've thrown a lot of resources behind making the best crossover/SUV on the market. I'm personally not an SUV guy, but I am impressed at the engineering they've done to make a 5000 pound vehicle handle like something much smaller and lower and still get 26 mpg on the highway.

If you are not selling SUVs you will be out of business. All car companies get this, that's why Bmw has so many different suv models. At least they still make sporty cars not like Acura who've become basically an suv only car company, their sedans suck now. North America loves their SUVs. We are one of the few families on our street that only has sedans

[zipstic]

I'd like to keep my e92 as a winter car if possible. Then I would get something fun for the summer. M2C, Cayman, something else?

I'm very interested in the next gen G42 M240/M245. But I'll have to wait until more details are released. The spy pics haven't revealed too much yet to really get a good idea of the styling, specifically the front grille.

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by rothwem

The ANGER here!

Honestly, though, you sound a lot like the E30 guys when the E36 came out, or the E46 guys when the E90 came out. I really like my E91, like a lot. I can see myself owning this car for a long time.

With that said, my sister in law just got a brand new X5 and its fucking awesome. Its not as fun to drive as my E91, but its easily the best larger SUV I've ever driven. Engine/transmission calibration is fantastic, and they nailed the ride/handling balance--hers even has the normal non-adaptive shocks. Basically, BMW has realized that people don't buy cars anymore, so they've thrown a lot of resources behind making the best crossover/SUV on the market. I'm personally not an SUV guy, but I am impressed at the engineering they've done to make a 5000 pound vehicle handle like something much smaller and lower and still get 26 mpg on the highway.

Sure. It's the beard logical fallacy. Just because you don't notice, doesn't mean the cars haven't gotten abolutely bloated. I will never like 4500lb land yachts, even if they say BMW on them and are straight line fast. I loved our E91 as well, selling it was a mistake (it took 3 years for my wife to admit it).

As far as the X5 - yes, they all handle and drive excellent, esp. for the size. My comment is more about what utter pieces of shit they are. Owning an X5 out of warranty or over 100k miles will drive you to insanity. Never have I ever had such a problematic car before - and I have had lots of high miles BMWs. The build quality is just shit, and much of the engineering is questionable at best. But boy are they nice when new...

[fastboatster]

Well, if 3 series have gotten too large there’s still 2 series. I think not all the 2 series are fwd based now, only the gran coupe.

[hassmaschine]

yeah, meh, I don't know. It's too late for me. I just don't care about BMWs anymore (I still like the ones I already have, though).

[tomgwuyn]

I might be getting an Acura RDX.

[fastboatster]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

yeah, meh, I don't know. It's too late for me. I just don't care about BMWs anymore (I still like the ones I already have, though).

What cars do you care about, then? Asking because I'm kind of curious. BMW's German peers are not the ones I'd care about (I.e., MB and VWAudi sport sedans are not better than BMW's. One of these 2 manufacturers is dead to me)

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

As far as the X5 - yes, they all handle and drive excellent, esp. for the size. My comment is more about what utter pieces of shit they are. Owning an X5 out of warranty or over 100k miles will drive you to insanity. Never have I ever had such a problematic car before - and I have had lots of high miles BMWs. The build quality is just shit, and much of the engineering is questionable at best. But boy are they nice when new...

Enh, manufacturers can improve. I think part of the issues that we saw with the N54 and N55 motors were that they were implementations of new tech that were large leaps forward. Turbos are tricky, and so is DI, and I think that BMW didn't do the best job of figuring it out at first. The B58 motors use commodity grade turbos and their DI system is similar to most of what the industry has used for a long time. There's nothing really new or fancy on the B58, its just a combination of lessons learned on their previous motors. Even Toyota seemed comfortable enough with the B58 to use it in the Supra, which says a lot to me.

As for the transmission, the 8hp has been around since 2012 I think, so I'm not overly worried about that either.

The transfer case is basically the same Borg case that has been around since 2004 in the E83.

I can see where your older X5 might have been problematic. The E53 was basically an E39, and the E83 was basically an E46, but the E70s were pretty unique and clean-sheet, its not surprising that they're a reliability clusterfuck. One of my co-workers has water in the frame rails of his...it turns to ice in the winter and clunks around until the car warms up and then swishes.

The G05 is two generations out though, and I'm thinking (hoping) that BMW has the A-team working on it. It uses proven hardware, and you can buy it without all of the adaptive suspension bits that can wear out in expensive ways. Like I said, I'm not an SUV guy, and I can't afford a 65k vehicle, but I don't think its a bad product. I just don't think I'm the intended audience.

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by tomgwuyn

I might be getting an Acura RDX.

I've got an RDX A-spec as a loaner right now since my wife's MDX is in for service.





Handling is surprisingly decent for a CUV, but the jacked up ride height kinda irks me. The seat is higher in the RDX than in our MDX. I can't help but think the RDX would be a better overall car if it were a 2" lower hot-hatch. But then they couldn't charge 44k for it.

The 2.0T has some serious balls, but it definitely feels turbocharged. The engine sound is pure Honda in a good way, but I'm not sure how much of it is piped in and how much is real. The 10-speed is calibrated well, it'll hold a gear a second to let the turbo spool, which is kinda cool. I've been in other turbo cars where the automatic downshifts too quickly and the whole thing just feels out of sync. In manual mode, the shifts are really fast and well rev-matched, so much better than the 9-speed in our MDX.

The SH-AWD takes a bit of getting used to. The car is setup to push, so that when you hit the gas it doesn't loop out. So you kinda have to trail on the brakes coming into a turn and get on the gas early to keep from understeering off the road. I'm sort of used to it from owning our MDX, but I don't really hustle the MDX around the twisty roads as much because the brakes SUUUCK on our car. They're much better on the RDX.

There's absolutely zero steering feel, but the steering is really tight and there's no slop at all. Steering weight is good too and the assist dials up and down with speed in a predictable fashion. The rest of the chassis has a lot of feel too, so the lack of steering feel isn't as much of a tragedy as you would think. There's not much body roll, but it feels funny being up high and tossing the car around. The X5 I mentioned before has a similar sensation though. Maybe I'd get used to it. The suspension is firm, which might be a part of the A-spec package, but I'd say its better than an E90 on runflats.

The main thing that's super annoying in the RDX is the radio/infotainment--its absolutely awful. The track pad takes way too much attention to operate, I just set the station on poprocks (XM12) while I was stopped and haven't tried to change it. If its a song I don't like I just turn it off. Thankfully, they made the climate control have actual buttons unlike our MDX. In our MDX, they're on a separate screen. I just put them on auto and don't touch them, sort of like the radio on the RDX.

Anyways, the RDX isn't a bad car. Again, I don't really think I'm the target audience, but it seems like a decent product. I'd be okay with my wife and I buying it and using it as a road trip car/her car, though we're a bit addicted to the space we've got in the MDX that fills the same role.

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by fastboatster

What cars do you care about, then? Asking because I'm kind of curious. BMW's German peers are not the ones I'd care about (I.e., MB and VWAudi sport sedans are not better than BMW's. One of these 2 manufacturers is dead to me)

I kind of don't. That's the problem. Everything is a crossover, with an automatic/CVT and a turbo, 3 things I would never find acceptable. So, I'll probably drive the E90 for a long, long time. Maybe I'll find another 6mt E91..

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by rothwem

Enh, manufacturers can improve. I think part of the issues that we saw with the N54 and N55 motors were that they were implementations of new tech that were large leaps forward. Turbos are tricky, and so is DI, and I think that BMW didn't do the best job of figuring it out at first. The B58 motors use commodity grade turbos and their DI system is similar to most of what the industry has used for a long time. There's nothing really new or fancy on the B58, its just a combination of lessons learned on their previous motors. Even Toyota seemed comfortable enough with the B58 to use it in the Supra, which says a lot to me.

As for the transmission, the 8hp has been around since 2012 I think, so I'm not overly worried about that either.

The transfer case is basically the same Borg case that has been around since 2004 in the E83.

I can see where your older X5 might have been problematic. The E53 was basically an E39, and the E83 was basically an E46, but the E70s were pretty unique and clean-sheet, its not surprising that they're a reliability clusterfuck. One of my co-workers has water in the frame rails of his...it turns to ice in the winter and clunks around until the car warms up and then swishes.

The G05 is two generations out though, and I'm thinking (hoping) that BMW has the A-team working on it. It uses proven hardware, and you can buy it without all of the adaptive suspension bits that can wear out in expensive ways. Like I said, I'm not an SUV guy, and I can't afford a 65k vehicle, but I don't think its a bad product. I just don't think I'm the intended audience.

Maybe. The E53 didn't age very well either. And it's not just the engine, the whole car is just built cheap. All of the plastic parts are crap and break. It's almost impossible to repair without a full shop. gaskets that shouldn't even exist, are put in impossible to reach locations and leak catastrophically. I think the newer ones just seem better, because of exactly that - they are newer and haven't had time to age yet, but I'd put money on them not holding up much better.

BTW, ours was $70,000 as optioned in 2008, that's like $84k today. That is insane (we didn't pay anywhere near that of course). And my 2006 330i is just a far better built car, which shows in how often it's broken (pretty much never).

[JingChai]

I wouldn't mind a Jaguar XE-R Sport or a Genesis G70 3.0T, both in RWD form.

However, depending on how the this decade goes, there is also a possibility I go with a Tesla Model 3.

[Vivek.]

Originally Posted by JonOhh

...there's a level of solidity and quality I just don't feel with the new ones.

Not dismissing the new BMWs, they're not bad by any means, but there's something different about them.

This is how I feel about my e92 coming from e30/e34/e39/e46

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by Vivek.

This is how I feel about my e92 coming from e30/e34/e39/e46

I had an E30 for 18 years, have a E37 Z3 for the past 23 years, a recent capture of an E46, and a E86 Z4 since 2014. Also, I dated a few E21's back in the day, with my first BMW driven being a 1976 E21 back in 1978. I can surely say the E90 is as well built and is a "BMW" as much as any of those models just named. Having driven a F30 for a week as a loaner back in 2013, I'll state emphatically that the F30 chassis was a marked and material difference in the progression of the BMW 3-series. Do a DNA test on the F3X, and little if any Bavarian nucleotides exist in the structure.

Now offering no 3-series in the US with a manual transmission, someone at BMW needs to get his head out of his ass.

[tcphoto]

Call me naive, an enthusiast or a traditionalist but I feel the Ultimate Driving Machine comes with a manual transmission.

[rothwem]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

BTW, ours was $70,000 as optioned in 2008, that's like $84k today. That is insane (we didn't pay anywhere near that of course). And my 2006 330i is just a far better built car, which shows in how often it's broken (pretty much never).

Ah ha! I think I've figured out your problem—you broke the golden rule of BMWs—when a 6 and an 8 are both offered, you NEVER get the 8. It's a recipe for disaster. You've offended the Bavarian gods by shunning the blessed engine configuration that is the inline 6.

True on the E39, E60, on the E53 and VERY true on the E70.

[oVeRdOsE.]

Originally Posted by tcphoto

Call me naive, an enthusiast or a traditionalist but I feel the Ultimate Driving Machine comes with a manual transmission.

Ive owned both and I can stand the automatic, I feel stuck . Even my 86 yo GM and my 65 yo mom still driving stick.

Yes a auto is faster and easier, so a battery powered dildo for the wife , but there some stuff I still enjoy doing myself

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by oVeRdOsE.

Yes a auto is faster and easier, so a battery powered dildo for the wife , but there some stuff I still enjoy doing myself

LOL

Well, on a 328i, the auto is not going to be faster. Possibly on the 335i, though.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

LOL

Well, on a 328i, the auto is not going to be faster. Possibly on the 335i, though.

Dude!

[tlow98]

Originally Posted by hassmaschine

Maybe. The E53 didn't age very well either. And it's not just the engine, the whole car is just built cheap. All of the plastic parts are crap and break. It's almost impossible to repair without a full shop. gaskets that shouldn't even exist, are put in impossible to reach locations and leak catastrophically. I think the newer ones just seem better, because of exactly that - they are newer and haven't had time to age yet, but I'd put money on them not holding up much better.

BTW, ours was $70,000 as optioned in 2008, that's like $84k today. That is insane (we didn't pay anywhere near that of course). And my 2006 330i is just a far better built car, which shows in how often it's broken (pretty much never).

Maybe you posted this somewhere, but what has gone wrong with your e70? Wife and I have been toying with the idea of an F15 BMW machine or Cayenne of similar vintage.

I'm wondering what the carryover for the F15 is like from your chassis. I think quite a bit in the drivetrain department, but have done zero research.

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by rothwem

Ah ha! I think I've figured out your problem—you broke the golden rule of BMWs—when a 6 and an 8 are both offered, you NEVER get the 8. It's a recipe for disaster. You've offended the Bavarian gods by shunning the blessed engine configuration that is the inline 6.

True on the E39, E60, on the E53 and VERY true on the E70.

I would have gotten the inline 6, but they don't come with the 3rd row seat. Funny enough, the engine isn't even the worst part about this car, lol. The only real big issue I had was the leaking oil cooler "gasket of death". But probably, the N62 is one of BMW's worst engines of all time (other than how it runs/drives), second only to possibly the N63 among their horrible V8s.

[hassmaschine]

Originally Posted by tlow98

Maybe you posted this somewhere, but what has gone wrong with your e70? Wife and I have been toying with the idea of an F15 BMW machine or Cayenne of similar vintage.

I'm wondering what the carryover for the F15 is like from your chassis. I think quite a bit in the drivetrain department, but have done zero research.

Oh man. I don't want to pollute this thread too much. But it might be easier to list things that *haven't* broken than the other way around.. lol. keeping in mind it's barely over 100k miles.

Recently, I need to replace a rear CV shaft that sounds like it's going to explode, the RDC system started throwing random errors, one of the air springs is leaking again (it's not too hard of a job I just haven't had time), and the front strut mounts rattle when it's hot (makes no sense at all). It's actually been parked since March, we have both been working from home and drive the E90 and E30 instead, and I just don't want to deal with it.