2007 CPO 335i... walk away?

spiike32 · 08-22-2010, 12:14 AM

So I've been calling/emailing a dealer and they are insistent that their price is fair.

2007 335i, CPO, sport and premium package, 36k miles, manual, 1 owner, excellent condition.

The car was listed at $35k, I initially offered $30k, and they want to meet halfway. Is this unreasonable? I see on here that people are paying much less, but I'm not sure if it would be considered rude or lowballing to ask for 28-29k.

Just learned about Galves, and I was astonished with what is reported on there... because the KBB on this car is right around $33k.

thanks in advance,
spiike

Repsol · 08-22-2010, 01:13 AM

I think 30K is more than reasonable. I would wait and look around and you will find one at that price.

Saigon · 08-22-2010, 02:24 AM

i would say 29k is too high considering it only has 2 options and no navi. 28k is reasonable.

xantdieselx · 08-23-2010, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiike32

So I've been calling/emailing a dealer and they are insistent that their price is fair.

2007 335i, CPO, sport and premium package, 36k miles, manual, 1 owner, excellent condition.

The car was listed at $35k, I initially offered $30k, and they want to meet halfway. Is this unreasonable? I see on here that people are paying much less, but I'm not sure if it would be considered rude or lowballing to ask for 28-29k.

Just learned about Galves, and I was astonished with what is reported on there... because the KBB on this car is right around $33k.

thanks in advance,

spiike

I looked at a 07 CPO E92 335i a few months back. The car had 21k nav, prem, cold, sport etc and I could have got it for 28k. I would have taken a bath on my car so I decided not to go for it. I would say that you can do better. Good luck.

Agent11br · 08-23-2010, 10:33 AM

You can do way better...first step: don't look in Chicago.

Broaden your search, I bought mine in Madison, WI and live in Detroit.
Got mine for less than $30k with more options although about another 6k miles on the clock. $32.5k is at least $3k more than you should be spending IMO.

Outlaw 06 · 08-23-2010, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiike32

So I've been calling/emailing a dealer and they are insistent that their price is fair.

2007 335i, CPO, sport and premium package, 36k miles, manual, 1 owner, excellent condition.

The car was listed at $35k, I initially offered $30k, and they want to meet halfway. Is this unreasonable? I see on here that people are paying much less, but I'm not sure if it would be considered rude or lowballing to ask for 28-29k.

Just learned about Galves, and I was astonished with what is reported on there... because the KBB on this car is right around $33k.

thanks in advance,
spiike

Is it an E90 or E92?

tony20009 · 08-23-2010, 11:45 AM

A good price is that price which represents all of the following:

it is a single price, not a range of prices
it is the only amount you will pay for a given car
it is a price that allows the dealer to make a profit

The way to negotiate and buy at a good prices is to know the price you want to pay and know that that price has profit in it for the dealer.

With that known, you tell the salesperson:

I see you have this car priced at (such and such). I cannot afford that much. I will pay X-dollars for it and I am willing to sign the deal now.

They will always counter offer, because not to do so would be a stupid thing on their part. When they counter, tell, them:

Well, thanks for your time, but that's more than I can spend. Goodbye.

Key success factors for this technique to work:

The amount you offer must have profit in it for the dealer! I don't know how you can actually figure that out buying a used car. I guess you can go with what KBB or some other such group suggests is a good price.
Research the car you want with the options you want. The only options that actually matter in used car pricing are: Leather, transmission, Navigation system, wheels, and suspension. Everything else doesn't really change the car's build or character.
Do not use this tactic if you are not ready to buy the instant you make your offer. This is critical because a deal now means something to a dealer. A deal anytime after now is a deal that is at risk for all sorts of things to change your mind.
You must not haggle. You made an offer because it's what you have (or want) to spend. If you haggle using this technique, you have thrown away your credibility because nobody who has a specific sum that is what they said they can afford to spend will agree to pay more than they can afford to spend. (Well, some people obviously do agree to spend/buy more than they can afford; those people default on their home loans.) This means also that when you get into the finance guy's office, you must decline the crap he offers to sell you, again, because it will cause you to spend more than you said you could afford. If you wanted the extended warranty/service plan, you must have stated that as part of your offer. Everything else this guy will offer you isn't worth buying anyway.
You must negotiate on one and only one car. The reason is that when you offered a price on the first car, you told them how much you have to spend. Switching you to a different car allows them to match the money you have to spend (you said how much it is above) with the profit they want to make. At that point, the negotiation becomes one of "this car is worth this much and that car is worth that much," and you won't come out ahead in that sort of negotiating situation.

If you are willing to buy any 335 they have, your initial offer should instead say:
I want a (insert year) 335i (insert sedan, coupe, xdrive, or deisel) having no more than (x miles) and such and such options on it. I am willing to pay x-dollars, (including/not including) the extended service plan/warranty, for it and I will buy it now. What do you have that fits my guidelines?

Again, when they counter. You will say:
Well, that's more than I have to spend. Thanks for your time. Goodbye.

Now you leave or ask them to call a taxi for you.

Unless I'm trading in a car, I go to the dealership without a means of transport to get home. Why? Because it reinforces the fact that I went there fully intending to buy a car and confident about the money I was offering. I have never had to go home from the dealership in anything other than the car I intended to buy.

I can absolutely guarantee you that if they have a car that fits your guidelines, and that they the can make money on, they will not let you walk out of the dealership because you told them you are willing to buy now. If they let you walk out it can be for only two reasons:
1 - They can't make money on your offer.
2 - They don't have a car you want to buy.

The reason this is so is simple: the dealer is in business to make money.
1 - There is a specific car you want and it is on their lot.

2 - You have money to spend on a car on their lot.
3 - You are willing to buy that car now.

Remember, you are conducting a business transaction rather than making a "feel good" purchase. The simple fact is that NO dealer having a clear opportunity to make money now will risk letting some other dealer earn that money.

(Here's a post I wrote that discusses the economics of car dealerships. It'll be good reading if you want to maximize your negotiating position and power. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=418219&page=2)

turbo335i+545 · 08-23-2010, 12:00 PM

I got mine for 30k out the door with tax

rabydanimal · 08-23-2010, 02:37 PM

FWIW I just picked up a CPO 335i with just under 30k miles and the sport and cold weather packages for just about $29.5k sans tax.

IMO I probably should have gotten it for smidge less but they put new rear tires and front brakes on it for me. Not to mention it looks like it never saw snow (amazing considering it was from southern NH).

lawwailok · 08-23-2010, 06:24 PM

i got mine CPO last year, E90 335i with ZSP, premium, navi, 28k miles on the clock, listed $36.9k and i got it for $31.5k plus tax. so i would the car you are looking at doesn't worth of what they are asking.

spiike32 · 08-23-2010, 09:50 PM

Thanks everyone, I'll walk away from this one. It is an e92, but from the feedback here, I'm so glad I posted here.

Tony, your post is invaluable info. I'll definitely keep this in mind.

mad_max · 08-24-2010, 04:32 AM

After posting almost the same question on this forum, I picked up a CPO E90 335i Sports, premium, USB,heated seats & fresh set of tires with 22k miles for $29K +tax.

It was a bit on the high side to pay - but they got me approved for 1.9% for 60 months through the BMW special offer. I could only get $14,000 @4% through the banks (not to mention many banks declined) because this is my first car loan.

Max

Outlaw 06 · 08-24-2010, 09:25 AM

The Galves trade-in (wholesale) value of a 2007 E92 335i with 6MT, Sport Package, Leather Trim (Premium Package), and 36k miles is:

$21,825
+ $1,500 (estimate) to recondition the vehicle.
+ $1,500 (estimate) for the 6yr/100k mile BMW CPO warranty (if applicable).
+ dealer overhead.
+ dealer profit.
= $ ________

IMO, you should pay no more than $27,500 retail for that car from a BMW dealer. It only has a few months of factory warranty remaining plus two years of “free” (minus deductable) CPO warranty, and the reliability on these cars hasn’t been all that stellar. That’s why their values are going down like lead Zeppelins. Your dealer is living in a fantasy world if he thinks a 4-year old E92 335i is worth anything close to $30k…

bimmer_335 · 08-24-2010, 10:08 AM

[QUOTE=Agent11br;7876802]You can do way better...first step: don't look in Chicago.

[QUOTE]

+1
Your dealer seems out of touch with reality and ongoing market conditions. I used to be a salesman... the longer a car stays on the lot the dealer will likely negotiate more. If its a car that they just got last week... of course they want to sell it at a premium. Banks normally finance these for 45-60 days for the dealers.

Also I never entertained offers over the phone. Thats not serious buyers negotiate. Go there... and take your check book with you.

David 12 · 08-24-2010, 07:04 PM

"Unless I'm trading in a car, I go to the dealership without a means of transport to get home. Why? Because it reinforces the fact that I went there fully intending to buy a car and confident about the money I was offering. I have never had to go home from the dealership in anything other than the car I intended to buy."

Tony, I like your procedure as long as you are a strong person and will stick to your guns. Too many times, customers are either worn down or let emotions come into play and end up paying too much.

I have purchased my last 5 vehicles over the phone or via email; that includes an online credit app for BMW and Porsche. So an alternative is to utilize your strategy but conduct the transaction over the phone and/or email.

Dave

AnthonyAlmighty · 08-24-2010, 09:31 PM

I just got my 07-Sport/Prem 6-speed with 30k for $28. It was more than I wanted to pay for it, but it was what I was willing to pay for it. They got profit, I didn't pay sticker and I got the car I wanted in the price I was willing to pay.

08-22-2010, 12:14 AM	#1
spiike32 Major 78 Rep 1,127 Posts Drives: Mineral White F80 M3 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: IL iTrader: (9)	2007 CPO 335i... walk away? So I've been calling/emailing a dealer and they are insistent that their price is fair. 2007 335i, CPO, sport and premium package, 36k miles, manual, 1 owner, excellent condition. The car was listed at $35k, I initially offered $30k, and they want to meet halfway. Is this unreasonable? I see on here that people are paying much less, but I'm not sure if it would be considered rude or lowballing to ask for 28-29k. Just learned about Galves, and I was astonished with what is reported on there... because the KBB on this car is right around $33k. thanks in advance, spiike Last edited by spiike32; 08-22-2010 at 12:30 AM..
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08-22-2010, 01:13 AM	#2
Repsol Private First Class 7 Rep 137 Posts Drives: 06 M3 / 07 335i Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: ABQ iTrader: (1)	I think 30K is more than reasonable. I would wait and look around and you will find one at that price.
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08-22-2010, 02:24 AM	#3
Saigon Brigadier General 234 Rep 3,525 Posts Drives: BSM E92 335i Coupe Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: SoCal iTrader: (47)	i would say 29k is too high considering it only has 2 options and no navi. 28k is reasonable. __________________ 07' Alpine White E93 335i M-Sport \| BMW Performance \| Beige l Piano Black l Sport l Premium l Heated l Navi \| Steptronic l Comfort Access l Logic7 l iPod & USB \|
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08-23-2010, 10:33 AM	#5
Agent11br Major 450 Rep 1,369 Posts Drives: F80 M3 6MT Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Birmingham, MI iTrader: (39) Garage List 2019 Jeep Wrangler ... [0.00] 2015 BMW F80 M3 [0.00]	You can do way better...first step: don't look in Chicago. Broaden your search, I bought mine in Madison, WI and live in Detroit. Got mine for less than $30k with more options although about another 6k miles on the clock. $32.5k is at least $3k more than you should be spending IMO. __________________ 15 F80 M3 Mineral Grey/Black 6MT
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08-23-2010, 11:45 AM	#7
tony20009 Major General 1045 Rep 5,660 Posts Drives: BMW 335i - Coupe Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Washington, DC iTrader: (0)	A good price is that price which represents all of the following: it is a single price, not a range of prices it is the only amount you will pay for a given car it is a price that allows the dealer to make a profit The way to negotiate and buy at a good prices is to know the price you want to pay and know that that price has profit in it for the dealer. With that known, you tell the salesperson: I see you have this car priced at (such and such). I cannot afford that much. I will pay X-dollars for it and I am willing to sign the deal now. They will always counter offer, because not to do so would be a stupid thing on their part. When they counter, tell, them: Well, thanks for your time, but that's more than I can spend. Goodbye. Key success factors for this technique to work: The amount you offer must have profit in it for the dealer! I don't know how you can actually figure that out buying a used car. I guess you can go with what KBB or some other such group suggests is a good price. Research the car you want with the options you want. The only options that actually matter in used car pricing are: Leather, transmission, Navigation system, wheels, and suspension. Everything else doesn't really change the car's build or character. Do not use this tactic if you are not ready to buy the instant you make your offer. This is critical because a deal now means something to a dealer. A deal anytime after now is a deal that is at risk for all sorts of things to change your mind. You must not haggle. You made an offer because it's what you have (or want) to spend. If you haggle using this technique, you have thrown away your credibility because nobody who has a specific sum that is what they said they can afford to spend will agree to pay more than they can afford to spend. (Well, some people obviously do agree to spend/buy more than they can afford; those people default on their home loans.) This means also that when you get into the finance guy's office, you must decline the crap he offers to sell you, again, because it will cause you to spend more than you said you could afford. If you wanted the extended warranty/service plan, you must have stated that as part of your offer. Everything else this guy will offer you isn't worth buying anyway. You must negotiate on one and only one car. The reason is that when you offered a price on the first car, you told them how much you have to spend. Switching you to a different car allows them to match the money you have to spend (you said how much it is above) with the profit they want to make. At that point, the negotiation becomes one of "this car is worth this much and that car is worth that much," and you won't come out ahead in that sort of negotiating situation. If you are willing to buy any 335 they have, your initial offer should instead say: I want a (insert year) 335i (insert sedan, coupe, xdrive, or deisel) having no more than (x miles) and such and such options on it. I am willing to pay x-dollars, (including/not including) the extended service plan/warranty, for it and I will buy it now. What do you have that fits my guidelines? Again, when they counter. You will say: Well, that's more than I have to spend. Thanks for your time. Goodbye. Now you leave or ask them to call a taxi for you. Unless I'm trading in a car, I go to the dealership without a means of transport to get home. Why? Because it reinforces the fact that I went there fully intending to buy a car and confident about the money I was offering. I have never had to go home from the dealership in anything other than the car I intended to buy. I can absolutely guarantee you that if they have a car that fits your guidelines, and that they the can make money on, they will not let you walk out of the dealership because you told them you are willing to buy now. If they let you walk out it can be for only two reasons: 1 - They can't make money on your offer. 2 - They don't have a car you want to buy. The reason this is so is simple: the dealer is in business to make money. 1 - There is a specific car you want and it is on their lot. 2 - You have money to spend on a car on their lot. 3 - You are willing to buy that car now. Remember, you are conducting a business transaction rather than making a "feel good" purchase. The simple fact is that NO dealer having a clear opportunity to make money now will risk letting some other dealer earn that money. (Here's a post I wrote that discusses the economics of car dealerships. It'll be good reading if you want to maximize your negotiating position and power. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=418219&page=2) __________________ Cheers, Tony ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ '07, e92 335i, *Sparkling Graphite, Coral Leather, Aluminum, 6-speed* Last edited by tony20009; 08-23-2010 at 11:53 AM..
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08-23-2010, 12:00 PM	#8
turbo335i+545 Private First Class 10 Rep 138 Posts Drives: 07 335i Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: new iberia,louisiana iTrader: (0)	I got mine for 30k out the door with tax
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08-23-2010, 02:37 PM	#9
rabydanimal Enlisted Member 2 Rep 47 Posts Drives: '07 328XI E90 Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Mass iTrader: (0)	FWIW I just picked up a CPO 335i with just under 30k miles and the sport and cold weather packages for just about $29.5k sans tax. IMO I probably should have gotten it for smidge less but they put new rear tires and front brakes on it for me. Not to mention it looks like it never saw snow (amazing considering it was from southern NH).
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08-23-2010, 06:24 PM	#10
lawwailok Lieutenant Colonel 146 Rep 1,922 Posts Drives: E90 335i, E70 X5 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sacramento, CA iTrader: (18) Garage List 2007 E90 335i [8.00] 2009 E70 xDrive30i [0.00]	i got mine CPO last year, E90 335i with ZSP, premium, navi, 28k miles on the clock, listed $36.9k and i got it for $31.5k plus tax. so i would the car you are looking at doesn't worth of what they are asking. __________________ -eric E90 335i TiAg STOCK see my garage for mod list.. E70 X5 SGM try to stay stock :/
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08-23-2010, 09:50 PM	#11
spiike32 Major 78 Rep 1,127 Posts Drives: Mineral White F80 M3 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: IL iTrader: (9)	Thanks everyone, I'll walk away from this one. It is an e92, but from the feedback here, I'm so glad I posted here. Tony, your post is invaluable info. I'll definitely keep this in mind.
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08-24-2010, 04:32 AM	#12
mad_max Captain 102 Rep 623 Posts Drives: Looking for E46 M3 Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Tampa, FL iTrader: (4)	After posting almost the same question on this forum, I picked up a CPO E90 335i Sports, premium, USB,heated seats & fresh set of tires with 22k miles for $29K +tax. It was a bit on the high side to pay - but they got me approved for 1.9% for 60 months through the BMW special offer. I could only get $14,000 @4% through the banks (not to mention many banks declined) because this is my first car loan. Max
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08-24-2010, 09:25 AM	#13
Outlaw 06 Major 212 Rep 1,071 Posts Drives: M240i (daily driver) Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: CT iTrader: (0)	The Galves trade-in (wholesale) value of a 2007 E92 335i with 6MT, Sport Package, Leather Trim (Premium Package), and 36k miles is: $21,825 + $1,500 (estimate) to recondition the vehicle. + $1,500 (estimate) for the 6yr/100k mile BMW CPO warranty (if applicable). + dealer overhead. + dealer profit. = $ ________ IMO, you should pay no more than $27,500 retail for that car from a BMW dealer. It only has a few months of factory warranty remaining plus two years of “free” (minus deductable) CPO warranty, and the reliability on these cars hasn’t been all that stellar. That’s why their values are going down like lead Zeppelins. Your dealer is living in a fantasy world if he thinks a 4-year old E92 335i is worth anything close to $30k… __________________ Last edited by Outlaw 06; 08-24-2010 at 09:30 AM..
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08-24-2010, 10:08 AM	#14
bimmer_335 Major 177 Rep 1,123 Posts Drives: 540 mSport Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: In the middle of nowhere, TX iTrader: (1)	[QUOTE=Agent11br;7876802]You can do way better...first step: don't look in Chicago. [QUOTE] +1 Your dealer seems out of touch with reality and ongoing market conditions. I used to be a salesman... the longer a car stays on the lot the dealer will likely negotiate more. If its a car that they just got last week... of course they want to sell it at a premium. Banks normally finance these for 45-60 days for the dealers. Also I never entertained offers over the phone. Thats not serious buyers negotiate. Go there... and take your check book with you.
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08-24-2010, 07:04 PM	#15
David 12 Major 127 Rep 1,048 Posts Drives: 2019 BMW X5 50i BSM, M Sport Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Omaha iTrader: (0)	"Unless I'm trading in a car, I go to the dealership without a means of transport to get home. Why? Because it reinforces the fact that I went there fully intending to buy a car and confident about the money I was offering. I have never had to go home from the dealership in anything other than the car I intended to buy." Tony, I like your procedure as long as you are a strong person and will stick to your guns. Too many times, customers are either worn down or let emotions come into play and end up paying too much. I have purchased my last 5 vehicles over the phone or via email; that includes an online credit app for BMW and Porsche. So an alternative is to utilize your strategy but conduct the transaction over the phone and/or email. Dave
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08-24-2010, 09:31 PM	#16
AnthonyAlmighty New Member 0 Rep 7 Posts Drives: 2007 - 335i Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Houston, TX iTrader: (0)	I just got my 07-Sport/Prem 6-speed with 30k for $28. It was more than I wanted to pay for it, but it was what I was willing to pay for it. They got profit, I didn't pay sticker and I got the car I wanted in the price I was willing to pay.
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