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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > THE ULTIMATE Intercooler Thread - What to Look For Before Buying an FMIC



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      03-03-2016, 10:35 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
The manufacturer of the intercooler made the comparison tests?
Guess so, take it fwiw. Still better than nothing.
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      03-03-2016, 10:38 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgop335 View Post
Guess so, take it fwiw. Still better than nothing.
No disrespect to you of course, but im calling BS on this comparison

First they used the cheapest FMIC wagner has to offer (EVO I performance) then they got ridiculous results.
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      03-03-2016, 10:41 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
No disrespect to you of course, but im calling BS on this comparison

First they used the cheapest FMIC wagner has to offer (EVO I performance) then they got ridiculous results.
No problem, well i guess its the cheapest for a reason
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      03-03-2016, 10:44 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgop335 View Post
Heres some good comparisons...sorry wagner.

Ams reminds me of the Mosselman.
Interesting data, now lets see it up against a Wagner Evo II Comp.

As Mike said, they used Wagner's entry level intercooler.

As always, you get what you pay for.
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      03-03-2016, 10:45 PM   #49
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Best cooler to suit stock turbos without affecting too much in response ????
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      03-04-2016, 12:00 AM   #50
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I like ATM Intercoolers. I've yet to install mine, but the craftsmanship is immaculate. Very nice.
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      03-04-2016, 12:50 AM   #51
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whoa did that thing fit under the radiator ??
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      03-04-2016, 01:53 AM   #52
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Best cooler to suit stock turbos without affecting too much in response ????
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      03-04-2016, 02:59 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic aces View Post
Currently have N54 Tuning catless dp's and UR cai. Running MHD Stage 1 93 oct. Was about to pull the trigger on the ATM fmic ($737 shipped). Have been thinking about it for months. Upgrading turbos is probably 2 years away for me.

Thoughts? Thanks.
Keep in mind to take some things with a grain of salt.. The vendors here don't sell the ATM so they are not likely to recommend them, they will recommend other FMICs (that they coincidentally sell) so you can buy those from them. The ATM is very comparable to the high end Wagner, and its the maker of the old Helix FMIC and is a very well-made intercooler, and quite a few other intercoolers that are quality-made are around that same price. The ATM/Helix has consistently preformed well in any reviews and tests.
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      03-04-2016, 04:34 AM   #54
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Only intercooler data I have seen better then atm us the newish Wagner evo 2
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      03-04-2016, 11:27 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torgus View Post
Thoughts on the helix?
Helix is a good core as well but I am not a fan of the step design.

Mike
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      03-04-2016, 11:29 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex68 View Post
Best cooler to suit stock turbos without affecting too much in response ????
I find the AMS is a great middle ground high efficiency core with a moderate price. Its my go to FMIC for most application if the ER FMIC is not in the budget.

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      03-04-2016, 01:03 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com View Post
Helix is a good core as well but I am not a fan of the step design.

Mike
Out of curiosity why? Step gives you a larger intercooler face which is more important than depth no? Also more mass as an intercooler is like a heatsink. One can argue the AD ICs are the best option for our cars for big HP and it is a stepped design...just curious as to your thoughts.
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FYI - I don't drive hard at all. So I'm not interested in more clamping force when I won't use it. Even on my car, I take it easy. It's just too loud to be enjoyable.
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      03-04-2016, 03:50 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex68 View Post
Best cooler to suit stock turbos without affecting too much in response ????
Mods?
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      03-04-2016, 03:52 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adidoman View Post
Keep in mind to take some things with a grain of salt.. The vendors here don't sell the ATM so they are not likely to recommend them, they will recommend other FMICs (that they coincidentally sell) so you can buy those from them. The ATM is very comparable to the high end Wagner, and its the maker of the old Helix FMIC and is a very well-made intercooler, and quite a few other intercoolers that are quality-made are around that same price. The ATM/Helix has consistently preformed well in any reviews and tests.
I havent seen one vendor say ATM is not a good intercooler . Is it the best? I personally dont think so
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      03-04-2016, 03:53 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brule View Post
Only intercooler data I have seen better then atm us the newish Wagner evo 2
Wagner EVO 2 is showing amazing results
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      03-04-2016, 10:29 PM   #61
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I had the Spearco FMIC as my first IC. It served my setup well when running FBO on a pump gas (91) tune using the Procede REV3 V5's stage 3 maps.

Boost targeted 18psi. Throttle response was great. But after I switched to the Flex Fuel setup from Vishnu, my IAT's shot up to 160F on a 90F day in SoCal. The car felt like crap pull after pull. The firmware targeted 21psi of boost and tapered to 16 I think. It was heat soaking even while sitting in traffic. Took a while to cool it down.

Then I got a hold of the CXRacing FMIC kit. Install took me a while since I had to cut a whole bunch of plastic from the shroud to make it fit. IC piping was 2.5" all the way to the CP.

The Procede was a great setup but I was getting all sorts of DME failures and errors. Got fed up and yanked it out. Bad harness maybe?

Switched to MHD w/MBoost on Wedge's flash that targets 23-24psi and tapers to 20psi (WGDC is at 70's up top, still plenty of room, thanks to the inlets) on e75.

IAT's don't go past 130 on a hot day. After each pull, IAT's quickly dissipate to 90F and drops some more if I stay out of boost. Results are dramatic at night or during winter where cruising IAT's are in the low to mid 60's, spiking up to high 80's after each pull.

No heat soaking issues. No lag on throttle response. No timing drops. Just running out of fuel, but that's another story.

I'm sure this kit can handle stage 2 turbos with a whole lot lower WGDC. But if anyone has the same kit with stage 2 twins, feel free to chime in. I'd like to know.
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      03-04-2016, 11:38 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
I havent seen one vendor say ATM is not a good intercooler . Is it the best? I personally dont think so
I never said that the vendors don't think the ATM is a good intercooler, I stated that vendors almost never recommend them and they coincidentally don't sell them (the vendors only really recommend the brands they sell), even though ATM has performed on the same level as the Wagner evo 2, and they are cheaper than either of the evo2s.

What is your reasoning why you do not think they are the best for that price?
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      03-05-2016, 01:10 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Mods?

Stick turbo and that will remain but besides afe Intake and cobb drive tune that's it atm ...I have coming er charge pipe and forge dv and dp's will be in the cards. I don't want a chunky monkey cooler that I need to trim and cut etc more effect response and low end torque ...so basically my initial thoughts are either mishimo or the 5 inch vrsf but would love all input
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      03-05-2016, 02:05 AM   #64
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I feel the ambient thermal management gets less love on this forum (vs 1addicts etc) than it deserves, it's a nice stepped core, reminds me of helix. It's proven very good. The VRSF 7" is still my favorite performance vs price piece. The ADE is hands down the best for dyno queens and hp seekers. My $0.02 of contribution.
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      03-05-2016, 03:08 AM   #65
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I'm on the same page as v8bait.


If your looking for the cheapest intercooler vrsf is the cheapest intercooler that will work as good as some name brand intercoolers.

If you want very good iat suppression intercooler buy ATM or Wagner evo 2.

Other top names are Evolution raceworks and et's 7.

High price, custom made, large, excellent finish A.D engineering for anyone with larger turbos.

If you have any other intercooler you probably have an intercooler that performs between vrsf and atm.

I owned Godspeed, atm and ad engineering intercoolers on a 335.


If everyone that bought a n54 just stuck to the names mentioned above you would not have an issue with fitment or performance until your over 600 hp and then you would start to need a custom sized intercooler.
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      03-05-2016, 03:49 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JValenzSD View Post
I had the Spearco FMIC as my first IC. It served my setup well when running FBO on a pump gas (91) tune using the Procede REV3 V5's stage 3 maps.

Boost targeted 18psi. Throttle response was great. But after I switched to the Flex Fuel setup from Vishnu, my IAT's shot up to 160F on a 90F day in SoCal. The car felt like crap pull after pull. The firmware targeted 21psi of boost and tapered to 16 I think. It was heat soaking even while sitting in traffic. Took a while to cool it down.

Then I got a hold of the CXRacing FMIC kit. Install took me a while since I had to cut a whole bunch of plastic from the shroud to make it fit. IC piping was 2.5" all the way to the CP.

The Procede was a great setup but I was getting all sorts of DME failures and errors. Got fed up and yanked it out. Bad harness maybe?

Switched to MHD w/MBoost on Wedge's flash that targets 23-24psi and tapers to 20psi (WGDC is at 70's up top, still plenty of room, thanks to the inlets) on e75.

IAT's don't go past 130 on a hot day. After each pull, IAT's quickly dissipate to 90F and drops some more if I stay out of boost. Results are dramatic at night or during winter where cruising IAT's are in the low to mid 60's, spiking up to high 80's after each pull.

No heat soaking issues. No lag on throttle response. No timing drops. Just running out of fuel, but that's another story.

I'm sure this kit can handle stage 2 turbos with a whole lot lower WGDC. But if anyone has the same kit with stage 2 twins, feel free to chime in. I'd like to know.
As I stated on page 1 I had an AA sport fmic and it was terrible cooling wise so I bought a vrsf 7" and sent it back the same day I recieved it as I was appalled with the quality! Got the cx racing 4" fmic and where temps were upto 160f with th AA fmic, the cx fmic they don't go above 110f. I'm FBO with inlets and RB turbos hitting 23psi on a wedge tune and my WGDC are at 40% up top which is lower than it was with the AA fmic. Quality wise the CX fmic is 10x better than the vrsf only con is its not a direct fit I had to fabricate my own brakets and you do have to trim loads to get it in, but none of that is an issue for me personally as I enjoy modding.
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