[GottaBeKD]

Originally Posted by stevers314

Please tell the wife that, it's been a while

Maybe you need a bigger nozzle

[iaknown]

Looks good. I think I will mount my pump where you did.

You mentioned tapping the tank with a fitting instead of using the factory one, however, I would bet that tank is relatively thin. Not sure I would trust any threads to hold a new fitting so I may be trying the factory one initially. Should have some exact measurements of the ID this week, hopefully it is big enough.

[Puerto Rican 335d]

625 aye mate

[GottaBeKD]

What removing the urea tank altogether?

There should lots of room without it to put in a flat tank and plumbing.

[stevers314]

Originally Posted by GottaBeKD

What removing the urea tank altogether?

There should lots of room without it to put in a flat tank and plumbing.

That would be sweet but probably difficult given how the stock tank is shaped.

[GottaBeKD]

Originally Posted by stevers314

That would be sweet but probably difficult given how the stock tank is shaped.

Is it not the size of a spare tire?

[TDIwyse]

Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d

Tdi question can you use the OEM line and place a new line to route it to where its supposed to be connected can it be possible? this thread is very interesting and i was thinking of doing it that way now that you put the schematic about it

I'm a novice in this particular implementation and will gladly yield all questions to stevers314. Whose implementation looks really good.

stevers314, where are you mounting your injector(s)? If you put them pre-IAT sensor you can take advantage of the DDE "seeing" the dramatically lowered IAT and it'll advance the injection timing to take advantage of this...

[gtp900]

Since our cars make boost so quickly, how can one control meth injection based not only on psi, but RPM's? I think my system would benefit from this, I would like to run a second larger nossel with a selonoid opening based on higher rpms, and run a smaller primary nossel to come on sooner for mpg gains, as well as power gains in low load situations.
So the question is where /how to tie-in for RPM's?

[stevers314]

Originally Posted by TDIwyse

I'm a novice in this particular implementation and will gladly yield all questions to stevers314. Whose implementation looks really good.

stevers314, where are you mounting your injector(s)? If you put them pre-IAT sensor you can take advantage of the DDE "seeing" the dramatically lowered IAT and it'll advance the injection timing to take advantage of this...

Both nozzles are mounted where the metal part of the charge pipe starts (below IAT). I'll take pictures this weekend when I swap the 225 nozzle for a 625.

Originally Posted by GottaBeKD

Is it not the size of a spare tire?

I think it's more flat and wide. When I crawl under again i'll take pictures. I think the factory exhaust is partially in the way since they designed it without needing to consider the spare well.

Originally Posted by gtp900

Since our cars make boost so quickly, how can one control meth injection based not only on psi, but RPM's? I think my system would benefit from this, I would like to run a second larger nossel with a selonoid opening based on higher rpms, and run a smaller primary nossel to come on sooner for mpg gains, as well as power gains in low load situations.
So the question is where /how to tie-in for RPM's?

It would be best to trigger based on RPM and boost. I've almost grown the stones to pick up an MSD crank trigger to test with. Also was trying to find a pinout of the DDE to see if a tacho output may exist - but i suspect there isn't one.

Perhaps what makes metering the flow based on boost acceptable is that our cars have a ton of slip at low RPM. I know my car seems to hit ~2k before boost can build to where the 1st stage trigger is set (13psi). From a roll is where I notice injection below a desired RPM.


I had whiteboarded a project that would listen to the CANbus and output various PIDs to an analog 0-5v signal. Tech-ability wise I'm just not there yet.

[GottaBeKD]

Just thinking out loud here. Would it not make sense to base the methanol rate on the amount of fuel being injected? More fuel equal higher boost to maintain the proper ratios.

Aquamist uses both fuel pressure and boost.

[Puerto Rican 335d]

Here's what the UREA did to my first tank, as you will see the tank can be utilized for. Sorry don't have anymore pics but the top part is where the pump goes I suppose

[DieselRacer]

I use 1 nozzle and make sure it goes far enough in so it atomizes perfect, sometimes the spray will be deflected and not mist but drip if the nozzle is not in far enough and the spray contacts the sides...

[austinla335d]

Originally Posted by DieselRacer

I use 1 nozzle and make sure it goes far enough in so it atomizes perfect, sometimes the spray will be deflected and not mist but drip if the nozzle is not in far enough and the spray contacts the sides...

My nozzles have a recessed spray for that reason. Best nozzles I've seen!

[GreekboyD]

Originally Posted by austinla335d

My nozzles have a recessed spray for that reason. Best nozzles I've seen!

Brand?

[DieselRacer]

Originally Posted by GreekboyD

Brand?

I use Devils own nozzles, the recess is not so important its the spray, theDevils own nozzles atomize the best, google their product, they have multiple test on their product vs the others...I have never had a problem with them, $400 for the whole kit...all recessed nozzles

[stevers314]

A couple pictures taken today after i swapped nozzles.

Both nozzles mounted in the charge pipe:


Throttle plate. You can see where some of the gunk has washed away as there is a distinct line on the left part where buildup still exists. No idea what it looks like further down the intake. I've had the system on for about 2500mi.


Other images are available in the album here

[austinla335d]

Originally Posted by DieselRacer

I use Devils own nozzles, the recess is not so important its the spray, theDevils own nozzles atomize the best, google their product, they have multiple test on their product vs the others...I have never had a problem with them, $400 for the whole kit...all recessed nozzles

I have Alcohol Injection Systems. (ASI). They make very nice stuff, but it can get pricey.

A few things just to keep things on the level: Devil's Own wouldn't put their product up against every other product on the market and release the results if they weren't #1. So they must be #1, right?

Except for the select bunch of competitors' nozzles, while plentiful, are not as thorough as a comparative shopper would prefer. I mean, can you name a brand or two who are not represented in the comparative data?

The other thing is that atomization is a consequence of a cause or two within the nozzle, and even at the pump. Psi, injection path, and even recessed injection, they all play a part. To say recessed nozzles don't matter because only atomization matters- that's sort of like saying pump pressure doesn't matter. It's a factor that produces "the best" atomization.

An injection into a 26psi 2.25" xxxcfm air path at x psi, injected perpendicular to the air flow, etc, all factors. The recess in the nozzle allows the injection to spread un- impeded (or less impeded) before entering the high CFM air, thus spreading apart more efficiently in laymans terms- better atomization.

The n54 forums debates on this topic are twenty threads and 500 pages long. But it makes sense to just throw out the idea that, despite self-proclaimed bestness, lol, you might want to broaden the scope of data beyond their own. Several competitors have the best nozzles. Sort of a paradox and only one can be the best!

[GottaBeKD]

Not only is the nozzle and atomization important but location can have an effect on the performance.

Near a bend the flow of air is slower on the inside of the curve vs the outside. Optimally you want maximum atomization and the faster flow of air. If memory serves me correctly from grade 13 physics.

Edit: thinking about it more and did a quick search. The flow is fastest in the center. But I remember something about the lower pressure due to more space and Bernoulli. Too late to bother reading now

[GreekboyD]

Physics? All I remember about high school was "Family Studies" and making food while flirting with the chicks:

[DieselRacer]

Originally Posted by austinla335d

I have Alcohol Injection Systems. (ASI). They make very nice stuff, but it can get pricey.

A few things just to keep things on the level: Devil's Own wouldn't put their product up against every other product on the market and release the results if they weren't #1. So they must be #1, right?

Except for the select bunch of competitors' nozzles, while plentiful, are not as thorough as a comparative shopper would prefer. I mean, can you name a brand or two who are not represented in the comparative data?

The other thing is that atomization is a consequence of a cause or two within the nozzle, and even at the pump. Psi, injection path, and even recessed injection, they all play a part. To say recessed nozzles don't matter because only atomization matters- that's sort of like saying pump pressure doesn't matter. It's a factor that produces "the best" atomization.

An injection into a 26psi 2.25" xxxcfm air path at x psi, injected perpendicular to the air flow, etc, all factors. The recess in the nozzle allows the injection to spread un- impeded (or less impeded) before entering the high CFM air, thus spreading apart more efficiently in laymans terms- better atomization.

The n54 forums debates on this topic are twenty threads and 500 pages long. But it makes sense to just throw out the idea that, despite self-proclaimed bestness, lol, you might want to broaden the scope of data beyond their own. Several competitors have the best nozzles. Sort of a paradox and only one can be the best!

I have set up over 50 meth kits and the only nozzles I have never had a problem with is Devils own, how that for data... I'll use whatever the customer brings me...

[iaknown]

Originally Posted by stevers314

A couple pictures taken today after i swapped nozzles.

Other images are available in the album here

I see you have yours threaded right into the tube with no bungs, correct? How solid were the threads? I am going to mount mine today but assumed I needed to weld bungs on.

[iaknown]

Here are some pics of my progress for those interested (not necessarily in order...or right side up apparently). I show both pickups on both tanks but I am using the pickup on the large urea tank. As you can see I removed the factory line and hooked my meth line up. The ID on the tank is a bit smaller than the hose ID (.125" vs about .170") so I will probably do some tests once the pump is hooked up to make sure it doesn't inhibit flow.