[Mr. 5]

So after reading Orb's thread with the M3 parts, it really made me make a decision with where I wanted to go with modding.
Here is the thread that is very informative.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=177028
If you haven't read it yet, then you probably should before reading on so you get some more answers.

Before, I was only concerned about making my car faster and faster and I was thinking that more power meant faster. It does to an extent, but if one has a better tuned suspension, yet it has 6 less hp, then this car will be faster on a road course.

So, I took the plunge.
Thanks a bunch to Harold from HP Autowerks and Evan@Tischer!
Without them, I wouldn't have these parts!
Hats off to these guys for excellent customer service!!

I ordered the following:

Left Wishbone link--31102283577
Right Wishbone link--31102283578
Left Tension link--31102283575
Right Tension link--31102283576
M3 Strut brace (All Parts) http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...61&hg=51&fg=75
Rental of my friend's shop was $50, so no labor costs.

Most would say that the under steer with this car completely sucks!
Some think that if you put a thick sway bar in the rear then you will correct it and that is so not true.
What will happen in this case is you will start to under steer, and then go directly into snap overseer. This is when you will see the world start to spin while you yell obscenities to yourself.

So, what happened after the install?
First off, the most important thing that I need to say is that if you install the wishbone links, you need to make sure that the same shop that installs these performs alignments as well.
Don't even think that you will drive to an alignment shop to get it done because it will be very dangerous.
Trust me on this please! I tried it and it was very scary!
I drove back to my friend's shop and adjusted it myself the old fashioned way.
I straightened the wheel and measured the front of the tire and the back of the tire.
The toe alignment was so far off that the rear was of the tires was 1.75" longer than the front!!

EDIT--When I did the allignment after the tension link install, it was only a front end alignment and I didn’t have anything printed out.
So recently, I installed the BMW Performance Srpings which called for a 4 wheel allignment. Now, I could finally compare the before and after of the camber that the M3 wishbone links added.
The M3 links added -.6 degrees to the left and -.5 degrees to the right giving the total camber to -.9 degrees on the left and -.8 degrees on the right. BTW, the tolerances are -1 degree to 1 degree.

With all that said, the feeling of the car is 100% better. There is so much more feedback with the steering. Meaning, when I turn the steering wheel, it's a bit tighter, but not too tight. The steering wheel doesn't try to pop out of my hands and it doesn't feel light. It does exactly what I want it to do.
Having said that, you can feel more of the road as well.
I do understand why BMW chose to put the hydraulic bushings in because the so called typical BMW driver would most likely complain since they can feel the bumps in the steering wheel, but I believe that this is a very important feature to have for a modified car. We need to feel the bumps in the road. We need to be able to react as quickly as possible, so the more information that is being transferred to me via the steering wheel, the better I’m going to drive the car.

I’ll give you an example, after I installed the lower links, I noticed that my steering wheel was vibrating on the freeway. It turns out that one of the weights fell or came off my car in the past and I never noticed it. I have been driving around on a wheel that wasn’t balanced correctly and I never noticed it. Once I installed the M2 links, I noticed it right away.

As far as the M3 strut brace, I’m sure it’s doing its job as well. It would have been nice to do one at a time but then again, doing everything all at once saves time and money, and let’s face it—I was excited to get it on.

The fitment of the strut brace was perfect except for one thing. The studs need to be taken out since the microfilter housing will rub on the studs. I went to the local hardware store and picked up some stainless steel flanged bolts. That did the job.

Sorry about the pictures of the compared tension links and wishbone links.
I forgot my camera at the shop so I used my friend’s camera phone.

The first picture is comparing the wishbone links. The bottom link is the M3 link. Notice how the bushing is completely different and that the M3 link is longer. This will actually add some negative camber to the front since it’s pushing the lower wheel out more than the 335 link does.
The second picture is comparing the tension links. The bottom is the M3 link. Again, notice how this link is also a bit longer, and look at the size of the rubber bushing. It’s very stiff compared to the 335 link.
The third picture is is a group photo.

The other pictures are detailed pictures of the strut brace installed.

[MuchMoore]

Great post! Dumb question, but why are the "///M" logos aligned weird on the strut brace caps?

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by ZHP DREI

Great post! Dumb question, but why are the "///M" logos aligned weird on the strut brace caps?

This is actually a good question.
The driver's side is on correctly and fits fine, but the passenger's side doesn't fit like the driver's side because the strut mount is different.

I looked on realoem and there is only one part number for the caps, so I don't know.
I've already sent Evan a PM regarding this.

[shyestsparks]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

This is actually a good question.
The driver's side is on correctly and fits fine, but the passenger's side doesn't fit like the driver's side because the strut mount is different.

I looked on realoem and there is only one part number for the caps, so I don't know.
I've already sent Evan a PM regarding this.

I don't know if they sent you the wrong part but on mine, the caps also have the same part #s and both driver's and passenger's side fit fine.

[Orb]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

So after reading Orb's thread with the M3 parts, it really made me make a decision with where I wanted to go with modding.
Here is the thread that is very informative.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=177028
If you haven't read it yet, then you probably should before reading on so you get some more answers.

Before, I was only concerned about making my car faster and faster and I was thinking that more power meant faster. It does to an extent, but if one has a better tuned suspension, yet it has 6 less hp, then this car will be faster on a road course.

So, I took the plunge.
I ordered the following:

Left Wishbone link--31102283577
Right Wishbone link--31102283578
Left Tension link--31102283575
Right Tension link--31102283576
M3 Strut brace (All Parts) http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...61&hg=51&fg=75

Most would say that the under steer with this car completely sucks!
Some think that if you put a thick sway bar in the rear then you will correct it and that is so not true.
What will happen in this case is you will start to under steer, and then go directly into snap overseer. This is when you will see the world start to spin while you yell obscenities to yourself.

So, what happened after the install?
First off, the most important thing that I need to say is that if you install the wishbone links, you need to make sure that the same shop that installs these performs alignments as well.
Don't even think that you will drive to an alignment shop to get it done because it will be very dangerous.
Trust me on this please! I tried it and it was very scary!
I drove back to my friend's shop and adjusted it myself the old fashioned way.
I straightened the wheel and measured the front of the tire and the back of the tire.
The toe alignment was so far off that the rear was of the tires was 1.75" longer than the front!!

With all that said, the feeling of the car is 100% better. There is so much more feedback with the steering. Meaning, when I turn the steering wheel, it's a bit tighter, but not too tight. The steering wheel doesn't try to pop out of my hands and it doesn't feel light. It does exactly what I want it to do.
Having said that, you can feel more of the road as well.
I do understand why BMW chose to put the hydraulic bushings in because the so called typical BMW driver would most likely complain since they can feel the bumps in the steering wheel, but I believe that this is a very important feature to have for a modified car. We need to feel the bumps in the road. We need to be able to react as quickly as possible, so the more information that is being transferred to me via the steering wheel, the better I’m going to drive the car.

I’ll give you an example, after I installed the lower links, I noticed that my steering wheel was vibrating on the freeway. It turns out that one of the weights fell or came off my car in the past and I never noticed it. I have been driving around on a wheel that wasn’t balanced correctly and I never noticed it. Once I installed the M2 links, I noticed it right away.

As far as the M3 strut brace, I’m sure it’s doing its job as well. It would have been nice to do one at a time but then again, doing everything all at once saves time and money, and let’s face it—I was excited to get it on.

The fitment of the strut brace was perfect except for one thing. The studs need to be taken out since the microfilter housing will rub on the studs. I went to the local hardware store and picked up some stainless steel flanged bolts. That did the job.

Sorry about the pictures of the compared tension links and wishbone links.
I forgot my camera at the shop so I used my friend’s camera phone.

The first picture is comparing the wishbone links. The bottom link is the M3 link. Notice how the bushing is completely different and that the M3 link is longer. This will actually add some negative camber to the front since it’s pushing the lower wheel out more than the 335 link does.
The second picture is comparing the tension links. The bottom is the M3 link. Again, notice how this link is also a bit longer, and look at the size of the rubber bushing. It’s very stiff compared to the 335 link.
The third picture is is a group photo.

The other pictures are detailed pictures of the strut brace installed.

Thanks a bunch to Evan@Tischer and Harold from HP Autowerkes!
Without them, I wouldn't have these parts!
Hats off to these guys for excellent customer service!!

I still haven't got that brace on yet....Glad to see you got the vibration problem sorted out.

Orb

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by shyestsparks

I don't know if they sent you the wrong part but on mine, the caps also have the same part #s and both driver's and passenger's side fit fine.

Weird. Then maybe I was sent the wrong passenger's side then.
You know, I'm wondering if the strut braces on the M3s with electronic dampening have different parts.

Look at the Passenger's side strut brace. (First Pic).
See how narraow the slot is?

On the Dirver's side, the slot is wider to let the part circled in yellow to fit in the wide area.
On the passenger's side, all slots are narrow.

[shyestsparks]

Ok, I just checked mine; the passenger's black tower part is also narrow on all 3 sides and the driver's the same as yours (lol, I was installing it at 12 midnight that's wny I didn't notice); but the cap on the passenger's side still sits as the same orientation as the driver's side.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by shyestsparks

Ok, I just checked mine; the passenger's black tower part is also narrow on all 3 sides and the driver's the same as yours (lol, I was installing it at 12 midnight that's wny I didn't notice); but the cap on the passenger's side still sits as the same orientation as the driver's side.

But how can the cap fit if the slot is too narrow?

[rwalker]

...I don't get it.

Aside from affording some extra protection against 'shrooming strut towers, I don't see the benefit of this setup over stock braces and the BMW STB. What am I missing?

Mr. 5, you were running the BMW STB (black anodized and everything), right? What made you change your mind?

Is running the M3 brace set cheaper? If not, is it better in some way other than the aforementioned 'shroom protection?

Off-thread-topic: Mr. 5, you should have (start?) a thread detailing where you're at now and what you're planning. You're running BMW performance shocks and BMW performance rear antiroll bar plus this set of M3 front bits now, right? When is your next track day?

Thanks,
Rob

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by rwalker

...I don't get it.

Aside from affording some extra protection against 'shrooming strut towers, I don't see the benefit of this setup over stock braces and the BMW STB. What am I missing?

Mr. 5, you were running the BMW STB (black anodized and everything), right? What made you change your mind?

Is running the M3 brace set cheaper? If not, is it better in some way other than the aforementioned 'shroom protection?

Off-thread-topic: Mr. 5, you should have (start?) a thread detailing where you're at now and what you're planning. You're running BMW performance shocks and BMW performance rear antiroll bar plus this set of M3 front bits now, right? When is your next track day?

Thanks,
Rob

Did you read Orb's thread?
The M3 brace is much better than the stock brace.
Look at the stock brace and how it connects to the part by the tower. It's nothing compared to how the M3 strut brace is attached to all 3 bolts of the tower.

Think of it this way:
You need to take a bridge over to get to the other side because there's a bomb on your side of the bridge and an earthquake, a fire, a flood, etc.

There are 2 bridges that you need to take over to get to the other side from safety. As the ground is shaking, you need to decide which bridge to take.
One bridge is connected by one stake in the ground and the other is connected by three bolts that are connected to a reinforced concrete slab on the other side.

Which one would you take?

[rwalker]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

Did you read Orb's thread?
The M3 brace is much better than the stock brace.
Look at the stock brace and how it connects to the part by the tower. It's nothing compared to how the M3 strut brace is attached to all 3 bolts of the tower.

Think of it this way:
You need to take a bridge over to get to the other side because there's a bomb on your side of the bridge and an earthquake, a fire, a flood, etc.

There are 2 bridges that you need to take over to get to the other side from safety. As the ground is shaking, you need to decide which bridge to take.
One bridge is connected by one stake in the ground and the other is connected by three bolts that are connected to a reinforced concrete slab on the other side.

Which one would you take?

Yes, I read Orb's thread. I wonder how fitting the (somewhat exaggerated) metaphor is, though. You having a few?

I'll try and stay in vein, though: what if I took a bridge that was braced in tension by another bridge normal to the direction of impulse?

-Rob

[JDLM]

Great thread, just a few more parts to add to the list, and finding a good shop to install these

[mikex25]

how much did everything cost u? Also how much did the m3 strut brace run u?

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by rwalker

Yes, I read Orb's thread. I wonder how fitting the (somewhat exaggerated) metaphor is, though. You having a few?

I'll try and stay in vein, though: what if I took a bridge that was braced in tension by another bridge normal to the direction of impulse?

-Rob

I was just having fun but there is some sense in the post.
You're welcome to come by any time to check it out.
Then again, you can go to any dealership and check out the M3.

Originally Posted by mikex25

how much did everything cost u? Also how much did the m3 strut brace run u?

I updated the initial post to reflect the aproximate cost.
I saved on labor though because installing is most of the fun.

[satakal]

your engine bay is too clean. Put some miles on that beast. And, I can tell that you change your own oil. See you in about 10 days.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by satakal

your engine bay is too clean. Put some miles on that beast. And, I can tell that you change your own oil. See you in about 10 days.

haha. I took delivery in June 07 and I have 35,000 miles on it.
I'm sure I drive more than anyone here.
You should have seen it 10 minutes before I took the picture.
It was so dirty it was embaracing.
Simple green is the best.

[satakal]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

haha. I took delivery in June 07 and I have 35,000 miles on it.
I'm sure I drive more than anyone here.
You should have seen it 10 minutes before I took the picture.
It was so dirty it was embaracing.
Simple green is the best.

I think we're pretty much tied.

35k/17mo = you
24k/12mo = me

2k/mo avg

But, it's not about quantity, it's about quality. What wheel/tire setup do you run on your performance days? Besides city miles, how have you tested the performance benefits of the new setup?

[Kev]

Nice setup. The M3 strut is very stealthy after everything is put back together. I like it a lot

[stressdoc]

Great stuff, should all be hassle-free warranty coverage.

If anyone is doing these mods, it would be great to have a photo documented step-by-step DIY.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by satakal

I think we're pretty much tied.

35k/17mo = you
24k/12mo = me

2k/mo avg

But, it's not about quantity, it's about quality. What wheel/tire setup do you run on your performance days? Besides city miles, how have you tested the performance benefits of the new setup?

Yah, you definitely have the upper hand when talking about the wheel setup.
I'll be running my 19" heavy CSL reps on the 21st.

I have 16 lb 17" wheels for the strip but I can't afford a track set right now.
Every time I change from the 19" street wheels to the drag radials, the 17" wheels are so light, I can seriously change the wheel with one hand.

[Richwm]

Originally Posted by satakal

I think we're pretty much tied.

35k/17mo = you
24k/12mo = me

2k/mo avg

Im inline with you guys also.

93K/42mo or 2200 a month.

[HP Autosport]

"Mr. 5"

Glad to help you out! If you need anything else or want any trick mods, please let me know!

BTW, in the strut tower brace kit I supply, you won't have an issue with the studs not clearing the cowling(if you do, it's very minor)as I supply the correct number of bolts and have the brace pre-assembled to eliminate any confusion where to use the studs with nuts and bolts.

Harold