[e90David335i]

THE INDIVIDUAL

Since 2003 everyone has effectively announced they're "going green." So, consequently, the automobile as we know it is starting to suffer. My passion is the automobile. So I can't help but disagree with the false accusations that are being thrown on the car. Car design is an art. Yes, cars can be categorized as art. I'll start with that. The majority of the population doesn't respect the car for what it is. "Art" has no "one" definition regardless of what scholars pontificate. They aren't qualified to make those blanket statements that frankly, don't make a molecule of sense. Art (to me) is man's triumph towards something neither you or I can understand. So then, why do people misinterpret the car? We, as a whole, prefer to categorize things into simple, easy to understand groups. The car as an entity is deemed to be "evil." However, nothing of the sort should be categorized.

Generally, we prepare ourselves to experience beauty and art. How is that so? Who decides how we interpret it? Potentially one of the most brilliant men of our time named Chris Bangle was the director of design for BMW AG. He later resigned due to his heavily controversial designs. Bangle built his life around the ideal that cars are art. His philosophy obviously reflected on his designs. When BMW launched it's new e65 seven series in 2002, people unanimously loathed it! That was the ground breaking event that led to an ongoing argument amongst scholars. Since then, I've been arguing with people trying to convince them that anything that man sees as an achievement or beautiful, that is true emotional art. A sense of fulfillment is required by the individual to make something "art." That's all. Beauty lies within the eyes of the beholder.

Nobody has has the capability of defining "art." Fulfillment is what matters. Soothing our egos so we can enjoy life and live another day. That is art. Life is art. We live aimlessly wanting the same selfish things. Nobody governs you. You yourself determines what is and isn't. Nothing determines the individual. No "higher power" can. We are the "higher power." Nobody else. Listen to the wonders of your mind that you'd typically dismiss because of false regulations. That's how WE advance. That's how WE learn.

[e90David335i]

wow... no opinions?

[BTM]

Not sure I'm totally with you on the whole car as art thing. To me art is beauty for the sake of beauty, serves no purpose other than being something nice to look at. Cars serve a purpose first and once that purpose has been fulfilled, may or may not be aesthetically pleasing.

[e90David335i]

"Art (to me) is man's triumph towards something neither you or I can understand."

Interpretation is the ultimate decider.

[BTM]

Maybe I'm not on the same sorts of substances you are at the moment but I'm totally missing what you're getting at. What are you asking, or trying to say? Why do eco-mentalists hate cars? Cuz as far as I can tell they don't...they love their hybrids...got my doors blown off by a Prius today and I was going 85 center lane

[VTECaddict]

I don't get what you trying to say or argue. You started with "green" and "false accusations" (what false accusations?) and then started talking about car design as art. What does car design as art have to do with your first four sentences?

[e90David335i]

Originally Posted by BTM

Maybe I'm not on the same sorts of substances you are at the moment but I'm totally missing what you're getting at. What are you asking, or trying to say? Why do eco-mentalists hate cars? Cuz as far as I can tell they don't...they love their hybrids...got my doors blown off by a Prius today and I was going 85 center lane

The essence of the car is dieing.
I'm simply putting the automobile into perspective.

So called "advancement" is savagely eating away at what I see as an art.
Car design.

[e90David335i]

Originally Posted by VTECaddict

I don't get what you trying to say or argue. You started with "green" and "false accusations" (what false accusations?) and then started talking about car design as art. What does car design as art have to do with your first four sentences?

I'm labeling the "problem" if you will.

Art is a selective re-creation of reality according to an artist's metaphysical value-judgments. (Ayn Rand)

[BTM]

Originally Posted by e90David335i

The essence of the car is dying.
I'm simply putting the automobile into perspective.

So called "advancement" is savagely eating away at what I see as an art.
Car design.

ftfy

And I see it as evolving rather than dying. Personal transportation isn't going anywhere, and the car is the current favored tool to do so. If you really prefer a previous iteration of the car's "soul" or "essence" or whatever it is your getting at then buy one of those. I know more than a few people who prefer their E30s to their 760s for that exact reason. But for most of use cars are getting faster, safer, cheaper, better equipped, and better mileage than ever before. If there is something that is being lost in the translation for you than I'm sure a better choice exists for you somewhere.

[kgb1637]

The car in its simplest form is a mode of transportation, THATS IT! An entry level Hyundai will get you to from point A to point B just as a Bugatti Veyron will. Now, some cars I could consider art, because just to look at them for me would be enough, a few Ferraris would fall into this category for me, do I think my 335i is art? No, its a way for me to get around, albeit, a little nicer than my Honda Accord.

[e90David335i]

Originally Posted by BTM

ftfy

And I see it as evolving rather than dying. Personal transportation isn't going anywhere, and the car is the current favored tool to do so. If you really prefer a previous iteration of the car's "soul" or "essence" or whatever it is your getting at then buy one of those. I know more than a few people who prefer their E30s to their 760s for that exact reason. But for most of use cars are getting faster, safer, cheaper, better equipped, and better mileage than ever before. If there is something that is being lost in the translation for you than I'm sure a better choice exists for you somewhere.

Car design has peaked.
Technically, yes, the automobile as a "tool" is advancing to become better and more useful.

However, it is transforming into an entity that revolves entirely around reality.

To me, I extract much more out of the car than technicality.

[e90David335i]

Originally Posted by kgb1637

The car in its simplest form is a mode of transportation, THATS IT! An entry level Hyundai will get you to from point A to point B just as a Bugatti Veyron will. Now, some cars I could consider art, because just to look at them for me would be enough, a few Ferraris would fall into this category for me, do I think my 335i is art? No, its a way for me to get around, albeit, a little nicer than my Honda Accord.

Completely missing the point.

[chromisdesigns]

God help us, an elegy to the inventor of the Bangle Butt!

[BTM]

Car design has peaked?

[e90David335i]

Originally Posted by BTM

Car design has peaked?

Proving my point.
I rest my case.

[e90David335i]

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[BTM]

We don't know your point! I asked you what your point was and you just restated some vague quote!

[VTECaddict]

Some would say car design peaked in the 50's or 60's or 70' or 80's or 90's. It hasn't peaked, it has just continued to evolve and follow new trends. If you don't like where car design is going, then buy yourself a car from your "peak" era of car design and cherish/admire it forever.

You still haven't tied car design to the "green" movement. Other than aerodynamics, technological advancements in efficiency are completely unrelated to the industrial design of a car.

[noro]

Originally Posted by e90David335i

Car design has peaked.
Technically, yes, the automobile as a "tool" is advancing to become better and more useful.

However, it is transforming into an entity that revolves entirely around reality.

To me, I extract much more out of the car than technicality.

I am smelling what you're stepping in. I do agree that car designed has peaked, if only temporarily. I think the problem has 2 specific roots, 1st one is heavy onset of regulations that in essence defines what the car will look like. Since these safety regulations are so specific engineers and designers at various car companies end up converging to a similar design, hence the components of artistry diminishes. This certainly explains why most cars from far away look the same these days. Thank god BMW has the double kidney grill feature to distinguish itself to some degree. The 2nd problem is the new trend of "getting more for your money" ideology that we are experiencing in the recent years. Most shoppers will simply go over the list of features between the possible car choices and settle for the one that has more options for the price, to keep up with this sort of thinking one has to replace "art" with more tangible items... like horsepower for example.

I was helping a buddy of mine with some car maintenance stuff a month or so back. He drivers an Acura, we had to replace a light bulb in one of his sidemarkers and getting to that bulb was an unusually difficult task. I told him that something as trivial as changing out a light bulb differentiates good cars from great cars. You can't write-up in the marketing brochure that changing out a light bulb in the BMW takes far less than an Acura, however you can write up that Acura comes with Navigation standard. And this is what an average buyer will gravitate towards.

I can certainly see how designing a car that is nice to look at, drives well and can give you easy access to key components for replacement can be qualified as art.

As much as I liked my E92 335i, I can't be any happier with my return to the E46. I feel like I am back with a car that has a true soul.

As far as my E30 goes, if we can call cars art then I am going to go ahead and call it a masterpiece. I often pop up my garage door to just simply take a peek at the car even though I am not planning on driving it that day... In that particular instance the car serves no purpose but to give pleasure simply by its existence... and that's a lot like art no?

[gun6slinger9]

Originally Posted by BTM

Maybe I'm not on the same sorts of substances you are at the moment but I'm totally missing what you're getting at. What are you asking, or trying to say? Why do eco-mentalists hate cars? Cuz as far as I can tell they don't...they love their hybrids...got my doors blown off by a Prius today and I was going 85 center lane

this just doesnt sound right hahahaha

Back on topic, how is becoming more eco friendly changing the way cars are an art form? The 458 Italia, Lp 670-4 Superleggera, the newly announced BMW Gran Coupe are beautiful works of art. There are incredible looking cars that are now hybrids, the Ferrari 599 has a hybrid form, there are Koenigsegg's that run on clean diesel technology. The art form of the automobile is definitely IMO getting better. If you want to go back to the era of boxy looking cars, weighing at 1-2 tons with black smoke spewing out the back be my guest. But clean technology with more streamlined designs are the future. Not to mention if CO2 and other greenhouse gases rises too much, our engines will no longer be able to breath and we wont even have the purr of a twin turbo charged inline 6.

[BTM]

Lol I was surprised too but had 50 champagne glasses in my trunk recently purchased for my graduation party...reminded me of Al Gore's son getting taken to jail after going like 120 in his prius high on oxycontin

[Evil E90]

Yeah this thread is weird. I have been driving for fifteen years and cars are getting better with every decade. Also they are getting more powerful, aero dynamic and fuel efficient. I still see art in today's automobiles. Cars as art is has not hit it's peak and probably never will. They are constantly evolving. More beautiful sleek lines and curves are present in today's car. Technology is always getting better. Cars are a means of transportation first. I bought a BMW 06 330i because it is a beautiful car and I needed something to drive. Anyone can make art out of a car but it also has to be something the masses would buy since it is also a business.