|
|
|
|
|
|
BMW Garage | BMW Meets | Register | Today's Posts | Search |
|
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum
>
VP Electricity finally gets audio in his own car!
|
|
11-28-2009, 09:02 PM | #23 |
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
Scanboy listed the parts here:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=251449 But read all the way through - the last two outer ports are inop. |
Appreciate
0
|
12-30-2009, 09:31 PM | #24 |
Brigadier General
300
Rep 3,969
Posts |
VP, any updates? How are those earthquakes working out? I am not liking mine, can't get it tuned to sound decent. I was looking at some other 8" midbass choices, all of which would need an additional spacer to make them fit. Any ideas? How about Morel MW265, I see you had them but didn't install.
|
Appreciate
0
|
12-30-2009, 09:54 PM | #25 |
Major General
687
Rep 6,845
Posts
Drives: 2018 Audi RS5 coupe
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Reston, VA
|
a suggestion on the SWS-8s
make sure after you mount them that they are tight i had a leakage on one side and it sounded like crap took me 4 days to find the leak turned out to be a small leak on the bottom i recomment using silicon to seal them now that both of them are air tight, they sound good giving them 120 watts each crossed at 120hz and they really kick still need a proper sub thought but just for below 40hz i think i swear this is a market for someone who does the install you just ship him your empty subwoofer enclosures and he sends them back with the SWS-8 installed and air tight with a short wire that has connectors that fit into the OEM plug took me ages to do all that |
Appreciate
0
|
12-31-2009, 08:35 AM | #26 |
Brigadier General
300
Rep 3,969
Posts |
I remember there being holes in the bottom of the enclosures, for drainage I suppose? Did you silicone those shut?
Honestly, the woofers were sounding pretty darn good before I put in the bitone processor, but now I can't get them to sound the same, particularly on the low end, so the difference surely lies in the processing. They are getting the same amount of power, 150W per side, difference being that now the signal is stereo whereas before it was mono. |
Appreciate
0
|
12-31-2009, 03:34 PM | #28 | |
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
Quote:
BTW, if SWS aren't sealing right, you didn't mod the bottom of the enclosure right. My SWS-8 sound pretty loud for woofers, when I run them all the way down. What I can't do is get a ton of mid-bass out of them, or to go up above 150 without voices sounding tubby. They are really a sub driver, not a midbass. These are 4 ohm drivers and I might try 2 ohm just to check if I can get more output from my amp so I can EQ a bit more. I am playing my 4" down to 150 and things are fine, but I don't lean on it hard like some people. I get the feeling that the underseat enclosures are a bad location to try to get midbass out of - I can EQ the midbass all I want and I still have a gap. Try experimenting with polarity - made a noticeable difference with mine if the SWS8 were in polarity with the rest of the system or not. Also, are you SURE you have the polarity right? If they sounded good before? Now, FYI, my system is tuned for hi-fi and a pretty flat response. I think, based on my experience, that most people wouldn't notice or call out a mid-bass issue. I'm being pretty critical here... |
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 11:13 AM | #29 | |
Brigadier General
300
Rep 3,969
Posts |
Quote:
Anywhoo, I have some more work to do with the low end. In the worst case I can still add a sub I suppose, but then again I cherish my trunk space. BTW, Happy New Year Everyone! |
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 04:29 PM | #30 | |||
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
One of the justifications of doing this system was being able to use the Zapco preset buttons to demo various levels of audio system. So today I set up a preset with the 650 running just F mids, F tweets, and SWS8s running all the way down. Then I set up another with those drivers with EQ. Then I set up another with rears (more on this later). What I found was that the SWS8 have a ton of energy in the 40 Hz area (based on my RTA and mono pink noise) and then there is a big dip around 200 to 250 I found that it sounded lots better with the EQ at -3 to -5 dB at 40 Hz. The BitOne has a 40 Hz slider so I would try that at -5 to start. Cleaned it up a lot. Still lots of bass but cleaner. I also got better midbass without the vocal sound problem by LP the SWS8 at 250 at 34dB/octave, and then HP the Morel 4 at 200 at 24dB/octave, and boosting the SWS8 at 200 Hz with about 3dB. Smoothed it out a lot, and the 250-200 handoff was still fine on the RTA (the driver's outputs in the stopbands are summing together to pretty close to flat). So give those settings a try and let me know what you think! I have the same problem that you have - my car sounds like I have turned the windshield into one big ribbon driver There is great imaging and decent stage width but no stage depth at all. I finally got my rear speakers working in my L-R experiment. The early pre-digital surround methods used a signal playing ONLY the sounds that were not shared by the L and R channels. Think of a Venn diagram and exclude the intersection So with a Zapco amp with balanced in, you can swap the L- and R+ in a modified cable and the front end inverts one channel and sums them together. You end up with two identical L-R channels of info. I delayed the signal 18mS and bandpassed the speakers from 300at 24dB to 7000 at 24dB, and I ended up inserting two dips, at 400 and 2000. I also ended up playing mono pink noise thru them (at the suggestion of a member of EMSQ) and changing the channel output levels and individual delays so that I got the sound as close to centered as possible. (This was really hard with rear door mounted speakers. I think rear deck mounted speakers in a sedan would have been much better for this purpose.) I now have the two delays at 18 and 21 mS, and I dont' recally teh dB difference - 2 or 3 dB. It deepens the stage a bit, not as much as I'd like, but it also makes the whole car sound like a small club. It actually deepens the reverb WITHOUT pulling the stage aft AT ALL. I helped install, and designed the system, for the original in-car DSP surround system CES demo car for Yamaha 20 years ago (Y ask Y? YDSP-1! : ) I have never liked surround in cars. But this is acceptable in that I don't notice the R speakers as a source of sound, but when I fade them out, I go from being in a live venue with good acoustics to listening to a really good set of nearfield studio monitors right in front of me. Anyway, audison says that the bitone has balanced inputs, so if you decide to try it, you can swap the HU L- and R+ on the bitone inputs if you have HiFi. If you have Logic 7 and are using the OE amp outputs, I'm not sure if the speaker inputs invert and sum or not. If you ran the Bit One rear outputs to any balanced-differential RCA input amplifier, it would be pretty easy to mod a twisted-pair cable to do this in the amp front end. Arc Mini? BTW, I used Morel Integra Ovation speakers in the back for my ambience channel, and now that I hear what L-R sounds like, I could have used factory speakers with no problem. Bandpassing them like this will prevent any issues with a decent small amp. |
|||
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 05:17 PM | #31 |
Captain
69
Rep 994
Posts |
lots of good info! after i figure out how to wire up my system with Symbilinks into the DSP6 instead of using the LOC you told me not to run, id like some ideas from you on x-over points (kick panel mounted 8's and the tweeters in the sails, not currently using the mids in the doors bc im waiting on the dsp8. im also running the12" sub. helpppp
__________________
iPhone 6 Plus (iTunes library/iTunes radio/Waze, etc) to Airport Express via AirPlay. Toslink out of Airport Express to Helix P-Six DSP. PHD AF 1.C tweeters, PHD FB 4.1 midranges. Jehnert Door Cards and mid-bass'.
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 05:29 PM | #32 | |
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
Quote:
I can't remember - You have HiFi or Logic 7 in your car? If you have L7, I would use the SLDIN.BTL. If you have HiFi I would hack a Symbi cable. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 05:44 PM | #33 |
Captain
69
Rep 994
Posts |
non L7 iDrive.
__________________
iPhone 6 Plus (iTunes library/iTunes radio/Waze, etc) to Airport Express via AirPlay. Toslink out of Airport Express to Helix P-Six DSP. PHD AF 1.C tweeters, PHD FB 4.1 midranges. Jehnert Door Cards and mid-bass'.
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-01-2010, 06:28 PM | #34 |
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
As you posted that I saw your PM... as I replied in there, with a Zapco Symbilink-input device, you can hack the Symbi cable and go in directly.
I think that you can eliminate the Tru line driver too. The DSP6 has a ton of output voltage. |
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 02:26 AM | #36 | |
Colonel
220
Rep 2,339
Posts |
Quote:
__________________
2016 Porsche Cayman GTS - Sapphire Blue / Black Full Leather Interior / Carrera S Wheels
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 11:09 AM | #37 |
Captain
69
Rep 994
Posts |
is that wire with the butt connector going to vehicle ground?
__________________
iPhone 6 Plus (iTunes library/iTunes radio/Waze, etc) to Airport Express via AirPlay. Toslink out of Airport Express to Helix P-Six DSP. PHD AF 1.C tweeters, PHD FB 4.1 midranges. Jehnert Door Cards and mid-bass'.
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 11:48 AM | #38 |
Colonel
220
Rep 2,339
Posts |
It is the cable shields within the symbilink connecter and it is setup so I can ground if needed. I will let it float for now but if I do get noise issues I will try grounding it.
__________________
2016 Porsche Cayman GTS - Sapphire Blue / Black Full Leather Interior / Carrera S Wheels
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 07:08 PM | #39 |
tends to get irritable
202
Rep 798
Posts |
everyone can relax...the LOC has been removed and Symbilink has been inserted
__________________
AC Schnitzer/Eibach/M Performance/RaceChip/Compustar/Drone/BimmerTech/FireTV/Helix/Dynaudio/Micro-Precision/Jehnert/Audiomobile |
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 07:14 PM | #40 |
Lieutenant
32
Rep 412
Posts |
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 07:36 PM | #41 |
Brigadier General
289
Rep 3,201
Posts |
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 07:42 PM | #42 |
Major General
687
Rep 6,845
Posts
Drives: 2018 Audi RS5 coupe
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Reston, VA
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 07:42 PM | #43 |
Major General
687
Rep 6,845
Posts
Drives: 2018 Audi RS5 coupe
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Reston, VA
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
01-02-2010, 09:54 PM | #44 | |
Brigadier General
300
Rep 3,969
Posts |
Quote:
I think I will go ahead and order an Alpine PXE-H650 and see how well it does. I have a feeling that the imprint auto tuning will do ten times as good a job in 5 minutes compared to what I could do in 5 months. (and supposedly imprint auto corrects polarities, too!). I'm really being picky here (as you say you are as well) when I say that this is not the best it can be - as I know it can be better - but my current set-up is easily one of the best I have ever had with one of the easiest installs. Being able to keep the OEM HU and not having to run heavy gauge gauge power, speaker and RCA cables from front to back and being able to achieve these kinds of results is priceless! |
|
Appreciate
0
|
Bookmarks |
|
|